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Imagining four Archers = Frightening

Ilovecric

U19 Cricketer
It must have been demoralizing facing West Indies in the late 70s and to Mid 90s. Batsmen must have been so tentative, super careful, fearful facing these brutal bowlers back to back. When you analyze the bowling avgs of WI bowlers in the 80s, they all averaged between 20 to 23 runs per wicket and it all makes sense. There may never be a better team than that WI Team. I love what Archer did to Aus's best batsman and the best in the world today, reminded me on Johnson bowling in SA in destroying their line up. But I can only imagine four Archers coming to get your wicket. :ph34r::ph34r::laugh::-O:-O
 

Lillian Thomson

Hall of Fame Member
Four Archers would be a picnic compared to Roberts, Holding, Marshall and Garner who were four proven consistently high performers. Not sure how often those four played together, probably not very, but one or two others can be chucked in.
 

BoyBrumby

Englishman
I think there's probably a distinction to be made between the best quick bowlers and the most intimidating. Lots of old pros seem to go for some of the lesser lights like Roy Gilchrist and Sylvester Clarke when asked to nominate who was the most frightening to face.

Jofra may or may not one day be worthy of mentioning in the same breath as the chaps LT mentions, but I do think his debut suggests he's going to put the fear of god into a few batters before he gets very much older, if he hasn't already. None of the Aussies are going to admit now they're scared to face him, but I've little doubt any of them will be actively looking forward to it.
 

Cabinet96

Global Moderator
The reality about the really best bowlers is they're usually too preoccupied with getting you out. No reason to dish out constant short stuff if you can easily nick a guy off. Plus there's something inherently scarier about bowlers who lack control, like a Shaun Tait. The idea that a rapid fast bowler doesn't really know where the next one is going is terrifying to face up to as you don't really know how to prepare. I think in the case of Gilchrist, he was known to bowl deliberate beamers on occasion wasn't he? Couldn't think of anything worse.
 

Ilovecric

U19 Cricketer
I agree with all points above, especially classing Archer with the greats just yet. But this is why they didn't lose a series. This explains all those 5-0 wins and 4-0 wins. I am too young to have memories of watching all four pace men during the great era of WI cricket, but just watching Archer and his ability to control a game and take wickets by bowling really quick just makes me appreciate how special that WI team was. Think about it, Smith won't be available for the next test and Eng may easily with the game because of fierce bowling by ONE bowler on debut!
 

fredfertang

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
In my playing days I used to play for a wandering XI (ie we didn't have a home ground). We weren't a bad standard - a couple of good cricketers, half a dozen serviceable ones and three or four (of which I was one) to make up the numbers.

It was all social stuff, but there was a bit of needle in an annual contest against the University academic staff. The game was played on a Wednesday afternoon quite late in the season and we always struggled to raise a side and they always used to win easily and were an arrogant bunch - one year in a desperate attempt to get our own back we persuaded someone’s mate, a bloke from St Vincent, to play for us with two of his mates, fellow West Indians, and told the enemy we had a three pronged pace attack.

We opened up with the lad from St Vincent. We knew we had played semipro football and he later proved that he wasn't too bad with the bat, if a little ungainly, but despite the long run up his bowling was dreadful. His opening partner was a bit better, but only after he slowed down to something a little over medium pace.

We were beginning to feel a bit stupid when the third one wandered halfway back to the sight screen and turned out to be another woeful pace bowler. Fortunately after a couple of overs from him, and once the oppo had stopped laughing, he proved to be a very competent leg spinner and we got the bastards out for next to nothing and won easily.

The moral of the tale being that one decent Shane Warne is much more use than three ersatz Jofra Archers
 

a massive zebra

International Captain
Four Archers would be a picnic compared to Roberts, Holding, Marshall and Garner who were four proven consistently high performers. Not sure how often those four played together, probably not very, but one or two others can be chucked in.
Holding, Marshall and Garner played in 26 Tests together between 1980 and 1987, but only six of these involved Roberts as he dropped out of the side quite early on in Marshall's career. The other bowlers in these 26 Tests were Roger Harper (9 matches), Eldine Baptiste (6), Patrick Patterson (4), Courtney Walsh (4), Colin Croft (3) and Winston Davis (1).

A more common fearsome foursome was Roberts, Holding, Garner and Croft who played 11 Tests together between 1979 and 1982.
 
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Red

The normal awards that everyone else has
Imagine when the Romans saw elephants for the first time.
 

Fuller Pilch

Hall of Fame Member
I've never listened to "The Archers" but it has been around longer than Coro Street.

Also the ones at Agincourt would've been far deadlier than Caribbean quicks.
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
I think there's probably a distinction to be made between the best quick bowlers and the most intimidating. Lots of old pros seem to go for some of the lesser lights like Roy Gilchrist and Sylvester Clarke when asked to nominate who was the most frightening to face.

Jofra may or may not one day be worthy of mentioning in the same breath as the chaps LT mentions, but I do think his debut suggests he's going to put the fear of god into a few batters before he gets very much older, if he hasn't already. None of the Aussies are going to admit now they're scared to face him, but I've little doubt any of them will be actively looking forward to it.
No one looks forward to it. Some just deal with it better than others. As you say, it's one thing to not enjoy it, quite another to be afraid.

The thing about Archer is he really cranked it for one or two spells but the rest of the time was mid-high 130s. So it's not like he's Lee or Akhtar consistently express (or even Starc, come to that). Which may make him more difficult to face in a way. Anyway, we'll see how he goes.
 
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91Jmay

International Coach
Archer's most impressive aspect to me was the lack of 4 balls he bowled but not covinced he has a Test match length yet.
 

Starfighter

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Archer's most impressive aspect to me was the lack of 4 balls he bowled but not covinced he has a Test match length yet.
He certainly found a test match length late today. Wasn't sending them down at a blistering pace though, just did what was needed.
 

Logan

U19 Captain
Michael Holding was arguably the fastest of them and batsmen wanted to avoid facing him.

Joel Garner was the most accurate of them and impossible to score off.

Malcolm Marshall was the best of them all. Pace, Swing, Accuracy. He had it all.

The WI quicks complemented each other.
 
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thierry henry

International Coach
Something I've definitely noticed with Archer is his pace seems to be unusually inconsistent, which is almost a good thing.

Maybe I haven't been watching enough, but I've definitely seen multiple overs where he'll be 136, 142, 138, 148, 136, 150 - that sort of thing (I refuse to use mph).

Reckon it would be hard because he LOOKS like he should be bowling in the 130s with the oft-discussed relaxed action, and sometimes he does, and then other times the ball randomly spits out way faster than it seems like it should.
 

Kirkut

International Regular
Something I've definitely noticed with Archer is his pace seems to be unusually inconsistent, which is almost a good thing.

Maybe I haven't been watching enough, but I've definitely seen multiple overs where he'll be 136, 142, 138, 148, 136, 150 - that sort of thing (I refuse to use mph).

Reckon it would be hard because he LOOKS like he should be bowling in the 130s with the oft-discussed relaxed action, and sometimes he does, and then other times the ball randomly spits out way faster than it seems like it should.
I think unpredictable jump in pace is better than being consistently at high pace, because a batsman's reflexes would never be settled.
 

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