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Good Coaches..

R_Powell_fan

U19 Captain
What are the characteristics of a good coach in you guys' opinion ?
Is it one who adjusts your technique or whole game to be sort of copybook, to acheive 'perfection' in your technique ?
Or is it someone who gives you a lot of time to practice practice and practice some more in the nets?
 

Kimbo

International Debutant
a good coach helps to perfect your technique, and also helps your attitude towards the game. they have to make it interesting. that doesnt mean heaps and heaps of time spent with you in the nets. they tell you what to do and you go away and practice that. i like coaches that make sense. the best coaches actually explain why you have to do things more than just how.
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
Some very good points there.

I feel that coaches should not look at a blueprint and try to produce a 'clone', but to work with the raw material they are presented with and emphasise that player's natural strengths.

That doesn't mean that you ignore the 'classical textbook' approach. With juniors in my 'other' sport, I start with classical positions and then work backwards - i.e. how do we get ourselves into this position in the minimum time with the minimum effort.

In addition, I work on setup, relaxation, preparation, 'keying' (the small movement you make which causes all the rest of the movements to follow which eventually get you into the desired finishing position) and above all, the mental game.

Now, you who have had formal cricket coaching (I used to just have a 'net' once a week at Derbyshire where I just bowled at people, nothing else) tell me whether that kind of approach which I use in tenpin would have a benefit when dealing with school and junior club cricket players.
 

full_length

U19 Vice-Captain
I think it would. Actually many good coaches follow that technique though I dont think they call it working backwards. I don't quite understand why you chose that description.
My interpretation of what you said is: teach the youngsters the classical positions (as in the prescribed way to play each shot, or the correct runup, wrist position etc.) and then do the fine tuning in making sure that in time they do the all the actions in sequence naturally (minimum time, effort?).
The rest of it is clear enough to me.

Actually this second part (relaxation etc) is the one that I think many coaches have to learn. Most people do pay attention to 'keying' as in getting the correct backlift, initial movements, body weight and all the rest of it. But the remaining aspects are often ignored/not followed consistently.

On the original question, yes, I think net practice is probably more important. Ideally, it should be something like this: what Eddie said to start with, then give them loads of nets, keep watching them play, and do the finetuning. Then you can compromise on many things like letting some bowler be openchested, a batsman have a Imran like backlift, etc.(or did i get this wrong? I thought imran held his bat differently with the face of the bat not pointing down?) In time, the coach should really be doing a lot of:
work on setup, relaxation, preparation, 'keying' (the small movement you make which causes all the rest of the movements to follow which eventually get you into the desired finishing position) and above all, the mental game.
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
My interpretation of what you said is: teach the youngsters the classical positions (as in the prescribed way to play each shot, or the correct runup, wrist position etc.) and then do the fine tuning in making sure that in time they do the all the actions in sequence naturally (minimum time, effort?).
The rest of it is clear enough to me.
The point I was making is that I have coached one sport (tenpin bowling) where there are so many moving parts and so many muscles involved that the only way to effectively get a novice into the 'correct' position to deliver the ball effectively is to take them to the foul line, adopt the delivery position and get them to copy it.

Next stage is to put a ball in their hand and get them to swing it like a pendulum (back and forth with a straight arm), allowing them to release the ball at the bottom of the third swing and encouraging them to swing another couple of times after releasing the ball to ensure that they don't 'chop' their follow-through.

Next stage - take them one step back from the foul line, get them to swing the ball as before but this time as the ball is going backwards for the third time, to slide forward at the correct time so that as their sliding foot comes to a stop, the ball is just approaching the ideal release position.

And so on.

It's a technique which teaches timing using a repetitive technique, causing a phenomenon called 'muscle memory'.

Once the tenpin bowler has developed 'natural timing' through muscle memory, then you can start working on other, more advanced aspects of the game (power steps, hand release positions etc)

I was just wondering whether a similar technique could be applied to cricket - either batting or bowling, because both aspects of the sport (cricket) deal with timing, weight transference, balance and the like.
 

Kimbo

International Debutant
well, this is all very interesting- i am doing my level 1 coaching course right now, my exam is on monday.
 

Neil Pickup

Cricket Web Moderator
well, this is all very interesting- i am doing my level 1 coaching course right now, my exam is on monday.
What's that like Kim? I'm hoping to do one over winter.

Another important aspect of coaching, I think, is trying to get the players to believe in their own abilities.
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
That's it, Neil - the mental game.

Buy a book called 'Mental Training for Athletes' - it goes through so many aspects of the mental (and physical) game.

One of my mentors in bowling (Dick Ritger - PBA hall-of-famer) also stressed the importance of mental training - not just preparation.

There may well be books on the specific mental requirements for cricket. People talk about concentration, but relaxation is just as important.

A batsman can be on the field for as much as 3 hours at a time - no-one can possibly concentrate for that length of time, so DON'T.

Learn how to switch on concentration at key points, such as when the bowler is just turning to start his approach. Assume an over takes 4 minutes - look on that as 6 intense concentration periods of 10 seconds apiece, interspaced with 6 relaxation periods of 20 seconds apiece and 6 preparation periods (when you go through your set-up routine and start to prepare yourself for the subsequent concentration period).

I think.
 

full_length

U19 Vice-Captain
Thats interesting stuff indeed.
I was just wondering whether a similar technique could be applied to cricket - either batting or bowling, because both aspects of the sport (cricket) deal with timing, weight transference, balance and the like.
I believe it is already being done. Infact it forms bulk of the work any good coach does. Another thing to do with muscle memory is that when the player happens to somehow develop a ruinous technique (physically harmfull to him or low percentage), the coach has to be with him in the nets to spot it and help him unlearn!
That's why many of them strongly discourage their wards' playing in streetside cricket and in general cricket with people not playing the game in all seriousness- they tend to develop flaws in technique that are shown up in a bigger ground.

I believe the mental aspects of the game are a must. This is often given less importance or taught with no real technique (players are given advice and are also taught to be aggressive- read offensive. that isn't enough).
 

R_Powell_fan

U19 Captain
Good point made by full_length, I actually have went through that experience as two years ago I used to think cricket is a boring, complicated sport and I couldn't get any of the rules, two years on and now I'm in contention of getting into first class competetion all through my suddenly awakened love for the game, but the point is once you start playing 'tape ball' cricket as I did and learned it was quite misleading as the balls behaved very strangely and when you go on to play top notch cricket you are found wanting, especially since cricket is played in Oman on Cement pitches and short fast balls give me all sorts of problems since the highest a tape ball will get to is between ankle and below knee high, so I have to agree with your point, anyway, I've had to change my whole stance, and my backlift is giving me problems but I've improved so much that I'm now in contention for the U-17 national team tour.. :D , I think I own it to my coach :)
He places stern emphasis on having a correct technique at first and then all those indivigual slight alterations will come naturally with practice, I found this way increadibly effective in bowling as well as I changed my bowling action.
P.S: I don't think I'll tour with the U-17 national team even if I was selected as I still have to go to school, unless it comes in the mid-term holidays.
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
Good stuff indeed.

I saw a demo of 'tape ball' a couple of years ago.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that Rod Marsh was demoing it on a 'Cricket Roadshow' - the object of the exercise is to show up flaws, emphasise correctness and to develop muscle memory.

I have used a similar technique with tenpin bowling (a tennis ball on a piece of elastic wrapped around the wrist) - if the swing is straight and unhurried (pendulum swing using just gravity, i.e. not 'forced') the ball will follow the arm in a smooth arc. Any forcing and it flies off to one side or the other.

Do it 1000 times and hey presto, a perfect swing which no matter how hard you try, muscle memory will not allow you to break.
 

R_Powell_fan

U19 Captain
Ummmm... what is tenpin bowling, is it like 'bowling' that they do with heavy balls to knock off as many of those white thingies as possible and if all of them are knocked out thay call it a strike ??? :confused: :undecided:
 

Neil Pickup

Cricket Web Moderator
Yep.. Those "White Thingies", there's ten of them and they're called "pins".

Hence the name "Tenpin". Hope that clears it up for you! :)
 

tenchi

Banned
I used to spend Saturday mornings in a tenpin bowling alley for around five years because both of my children used to play as juniors.

It is very expensive ("What would you like for your birthday dear?"
"A new bowling ball, Father - £150".
"How much ??????")

I tried playing myself a few times. Not for me - I will stick to golf, thank you.
 

Kimbo

International Debutant
well, this is all very interesting- i am doing my level 1 coaching course right now, my exam is on monday.
What's that like Kim? I'm hoping to do one over winter.

Another important aspect of coaching, I think, is trying to get the players to believe in their own abilities.
It's good doing a level 1. It's quite funny because even though its really basic you learn things that you didn't know, like reasons why you do things a certain way.
Apparently the English level one isnt as good as the New Zealand one, I think it's more basic or something.
 

tenchi

Banned
Yeah thanks a heap Neil , But what are bowling balls made from ??
I know this.....

You don't share a household with a bowler for years and not know something.

They used to be made out of rubber, were then made out of plastic and are now made out of stuff called 'reactive resin'
 

R_Powell_fan

U19 Captain
Okay thanks tenchi, so basically they are made from the same stuff non electrolytic capacitor casing in made from. :D
 

tenchi

Banned
I will take your word for it.

I am not of this era.

For me, life took a downward turn the day they stopped putting starting-handles on the front of motor cars.

I think that the downward spiral started in the 1960's when the third television channel started transmission.
 

Neil Pickup

Cricket Web Moderator
well, this is all very interesting- i am doing my level 1 coaching course right now, my exam is on monday.
What's that like Kim? I'm hoping to do one over winter.

Another important aspect of coaching, I think, is trying to get the players to believe in their own abilities.
It's good doing a level 1. It's quite funny because even though its really basic you learn things that you didn't know, like reasons why you do things a certain way.
Apparently the English level one isnt as good as the New Zealand one, I think it's more basic or something.
Nice... :D

I look forward to it... I probably need some of the more basic stuff anyway :D 8D :D
 

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