Curtly Ambrose vs Jimmy Anderson

[weldone]

I was going through the top wicket-takers and noticed Ntini and Broad have incredibly similar test records

Ntini 390 wickets @ 28.8
Broad 388 wickets @ 28.8

Didn't we almost forget Ntini too soon? He doesn't come up in any discussions anywhere.

 

[Groundking]

I was going through the top wicket-takers and noticed Ntini and Broad have incredibly similar test records

Ntini 390 wickets @ 28.8
Broad 388 wickets @ 28.8

Didn't we almost forget Ntini too soon? He doesn't come up in any discussions anywhere.

Ntini comes from a country that regularily produces unbelievably good bowlers that overshadow him. Also the only reason Broad will be spoken about 8 years post retirement is because of his god mode spells against Australia and South Africa (for instance). I'm still expecting Broads average to finish greater than 30 too.

 

[_00_deathscar]

I was going through the top wicket-takers and noticed Ntini and Broad have incredibly similar test records

Ntini 390 wickets @ 28.8
Broad 388 wickets @ 28.8

Didn't we almost forget Ntini too soon? He doesn't come up in any discussions anywhere.

South Africa just have a ridiculous riches of fast bowlers that someone with the longevity (and good average, strike rate - good bowler in all) doesn't even enter the discussion - didn't play anywhere near as much as Ntini for obvious reasons, but Fanie de Viliers is another of the ilk. Ntini would be an ATG in India as a bowler.

 

[The Sean]

I was going through the top wicket-takers and noticed Ntini and Broad have incredibly similar test records

Ntini 390 wickets @ 28.8
Broad 388 wickets @ 28.8

Didn't we almost forget Ntini too soon? He doesn't come up in any discussions anywhere.

According to Alec Stewart, they're both better than Malcolm Marshall.

 

[weldone]

According to Alec Stewart, they're both better than Malcolm Marshall.

And Atherton is better than Bradman, too.

 

[DriveClub]

Wait, a person who used movement through the air to great effect is the furthest thing from a swing bowler? Really?

I dont know if you consider reverse swing as traditional swing and he only had the out swinger, just used a straight/off cutter to bring it back in. His yorkers were most effective when it was reversing

 

[Starfighter]

I dont know if you consider reverse swing as traditional swing and he only had the out swinger, just used a straight/off cutter to bring it back in. His yorkers were most effective when it was reversing

You said he was 'furthest thing' from a swing bowler though, yet you admit that he had an out-swinger, and yes reverse swing is swing as well. He wouldn't have been anywhere near the bowler he was without swing. The 'furthest thing' from a swing bowler is someone like McGrath who hardly ever moved the ball in the air or used it to get wickets.

 

[DriveClub]

You said he was 'furthest thing' from a swing bowler though, yet you admit that he had an out-swinger, and yes reverse swing is swing as well. He wouldn't have been anywhere near the bowler he was without swing. The 'furthest thing' from a swing bowler is someone like McGrath who hardly ever moved the ball in the air or used it to get wickets.

I dont exactly consider reverse swing swing bowling in that sense, he only used the out swinger when the bowl was new then he reverted to seam/reverse swing.

 

[Spark]

Don't remember slippy. Must have been a boring troll. blocky was a kiwi troll who riled kiwis up hilariously and listentome was your standard edgy troll who was easy to manipulate.

LTM made multis. I don't actually remember the original ban reason, it was either trolling or racist cracks.

I dont exactly consider reverse swing swing bowling in that sense, he only used the out swinger when the bowl was new then he reverted to seam/reverse swing.

Would like to hear of this mythical swing bowler who swings the ball conventionally with the old ball in conditions not atmospherically conducive to swing.

Literally no one outside of England or SA is a swing bowler under this definition.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I dont exactly consider reverse swing swing bowling in that sense, he only used the out swinger when the bowl was new then he reverted to seam/reverse swing.

Most swing bowlers are like this. Steyn is pretty much exactly what you described.

 

[Spark]

Most swing bowlers are like this. Steyn is pretty much exactly what you described.

Every swing bowler is like this, given we're talking about subcontinent conditions wrt Waqar.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Today I learned Waqar Younis wasn't a swing bowler.

Up next, Shoaib Akhtar was a medium pacer

 

[OverratedSanity]

Every swing bowler is like this, given we're talking about subcontinent conditions wrt Waqar.

I think his point was that Waqar didn't have a conventional inswinger and with the old ball only really had the reverse inswinger (ie) both with the new and old ball, he generally got it to move only one way... Out with the new ball, in with the old.

Only a rare few like Wasim and Anderson can get it to consistently go both ways with both conventional and reverse swing.

 

[Spark]

I think his point was that Waqar didn't have a conventional inswinger and with the old ball only really had the reverse inswinger (ie) both with the new and old ball, he generally got it to move only one way... Out with the new ball, in with the old.

Only a rare few like Wasim and Anderson can get it to consistently go both ways with both conventional and reverse swing.

You don't need a conventional inswinger to take stacks and stacks of wickets with swing bowling though. See Steyn, Dale

 

[Starfighter]

Yeah, to determine whether someone is a swing bowler you ask whether they use swing as their primary method of getting wickets, not can they bowl inswing/outswing/backswing/squareswing/slantswing and so on. Steyn only swings the ball out but he has possibly the best out-swinger of any bowler ever, and picks up lots of wickets with it. And I don't think there's any swing bowler who's been really successful who hasn't also taken wickets using movement off the pitch, as that's simply what happens.

 

[Shri]

When you think about Waqar, you think about in-swinging yorkers at pace. Cut driveclub some slack, he can be forgiven for forgetting the in-swing and just remembering the pace.

 

[Victor Ian]

Have I missed Steyn's retirement? Did he?

 

[DriveClub]

Fk all of you, I only consider someone a swing bowler if they can do both the in and out swinger

 

[Starfighter]

ok

 

[Groundking]

Have I missed Steyn's retirement? Did he?

No, but who actually expects him to play any significant number of tests moving forwards anymore?