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Zinzan

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Sehwag309 said:
More and More teams are starting to feel the heat..is it just a coincidence?

Bowden turns down Woolmer umpiring appeal
Its been known for years and years, but no-one had the guts to come out and say what Woolmer has just stated. I've suggested it once on this forum and got absolutely shot down by Scallywag and a few others. I wasn't actually stating they (the umpires) were cheats, just that they seem to crumble under the pressure in favour of the home side in Australia.

Having said that, I think ALL home teams seem to get the rub of the green with the close calls, but none as much as Australia.

They are hard enough to beat anyway...without having decisions going against you by 5 to 1
 

Deja moo

International Captain
The problem is that some people do not take this as a criticism of the umpires. They seem to take it as an affront to their cricket team .
 

Sehwag309

Banned
The best part is it still goes one. Scallywag is just 1 member..doesn't matter if he/she agrees or not

But I appreciate Woolmer coming out and saying. When India complained, not officially, everyone laughed including Pakistanis. Now they felt the pinch, I am glad he came out and spoke...

Not sure, if this nonsense will stop or not, but its getting more and more visible in the umpiring decisions
 

Zinzan

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Of course Bowden (and any international umpire) is going to reject Woolmers Claims. He's hardly going to agree is he...
 

Dasa

International Vice-Captain
I'd be interested to see how these comments would be recieved had they come from John Buchanan rather than Bob Woolmer...
 

telsor

U19 12th Man
I agree with the central idea..ie, that close calls tend to favor the home team.

I'm not really sure how this would hold up as 'Australia gains more', but I'd be interested to see a study on the whole topic.

I do have a problem with the numbers though, because they were compiled by an affected group..Let's face it, supporters of different teams have a tendancy to call different things 'close'. I'm sure people in the Australian team could do a similar study, on the same series and get different numbers..I would doubt both results.

I would think a neutral observer would come up with a figure of ~3-1. Of course, this still isn't acceptable.

The only solution I can think of would be for the umpires to review all such decisions after each match/series. I would hope they already do something like this.

NB. Until technology can be done in real time ( <5 seconds ) with very good accuracy (99%+) I don't consider it a solution. For those who talk about hawkeye, at the recent Australian open tennis, the slow motions replays seemed to disagree with it on several occasions, and the cameras for it are a lot close to the action than they would be in cricket and arguably were performing a simpler task.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
zinzan12 said:
Its been known for years and years, but no-one had the guts to come out and say what Woolmer has just stated.
All he's said is that of the close calls 29 have gone one way 6 have gone the other.

Is it out of the realms of possibility that most of those 29 were actually good calls?
 

Dasa

International Vice-Captain
marc71178 said:
What do you mean by that?
I have a feeling many people would be a bit more open to criticism if it came from Buchanan. There's a significant divide in cricket between the subcontinent and those outside. If the comments were to come from someone outside (i.e. Buchanan), they'd be well-recieved I think. Whatever people say, the fact that there is a perception that subcontinental teams are hard done by when it comes to umpiring decisions and the like must stem from somewhere. We don't complain for the sake of complaining. However, I suspect many people would rather dismiss these problems than deal with them.
 

Scallywag

Banned
Dasa said:
I have a feeling many people would be a bit more open to criticism if it came from Buchanan. There's a significant divide in cricket between the subcontinent and those outside. If the comments were to come from someone outside (i.e. Buchanan), they'd be well-recieved I think. Whatever people say, the fact that there is a perception that subcontinental teams are hard done by when it comes to umpiring decisions and the like must stem from somewhere. We don't complain for the sake of complaining. However, I suspect many people would rather dismiss these problems than deal with them.
Paranoia spings to mind but I think its just using the race card whenever the opposition is white.
 

shaka

International Regular
the supporters of the accusations by woolmer come from reputed guys of both sides, Waqar Younis (ex Pakistan captain) and Mark Richardson who has recently retired from cricket.
 

C_C

International Captain
Paranoia spings to mind but I think its just using the race card whenever the opposition is white.
Can you blame them ?
Given what the white have done in the past 300 years(look at yer country. You robbed and butchered the original inhabitants), i would say it would be a while till the colored world trusts the white again.

And i guess Woolmer(a fella whitey) or Richardson( another whitey) are playing the race card too
8-) 8-) 8-)

And if you feel that the umpires have not been biassed but merely erroneous, then you should have no problems with the introduction of technology in it.
Technology can be faulty(although cyclops, snicko and hawkeye are more accurate than umpires), they definately cannot be biassed like a human being can be.
 

telsor

U19 12th Man
C_C said:
And if you feel that the umpires have not been biassed but merely erroneous, then you should have no problems with the introduction of technology in it.
Technology can be faulty(although cyclops, snicko and hawkeye are more accurate than umpires), they definately cannot be biassed like a human being can be.
Not certain about them being significantly 'more accurate than umpires', but my problem with them is that they're SLOW. With it just being a TV thing, it doesn't slow the game up because they fix it all up while bowlers are walking back to their marks and the like ( ever notice that they tend to show these things a ball or two later, especially with spinners? ).


On the race point, I'll mention that when Aus complains about stuff in India ( to give a recent example ), we're told to shut up because we're being racist, and when pakistan complains about stuff in Aus, it's because Aus is racist. Talk about lose-lose.
 

meatspx

U19 Cricketer
Keep the race card out of it.

If you are going to bring up colonisation, then others will bring up other examples of genocide, ie. what Pakistan military forces did to Bangladesh, not too long ago.

And Richardson is NOT playing the race card, read what he has said again.
 

C_C

International Captain
Not certain about them being significantly 'more accurate than umpires', but my problem with them is that they're SLOW. With it just being a TV thing, it doesn't slow the game up because they fix it all up while bowlers are walking back to their marks and the like ( ever notice that they tend to show these things a ball or two later, especially with spinners? ).
I am sure a system can be implemented where the process is significantly speeded up....
You can appeal to the umpire for lbws, he activates the responder for the equipment(i think all lbw referrals should be done to the hawkeye) and a red/green verdict from the machine is given.
Considering all it is is algorithms and analysis, you can get it done in no time.
You can do significant simulations from the processing power of the average PC at home and this isnt too comlex a simulations( 7-8 parameters or so)

And the cyclops thing..it can be instantaneous for no-balls...just like they have it for serves in tennis.

On the race point, I'll mention that when Aus complains about stuff in India ( to give a recent example ), we're told to shut up because we're being racist, and when pakistan complains about stuff in Aus, it's because Aus is racist. Talk about lose-lose.
race problems exist everywhere. The question is degree and acceptance.
Most people do not like to accept the racism in their backyards which is why an observation on racial tones is commonly countered by " well what about your country?" kinda line...thats a basic defensive mechanism.
I've had a multicultural upbringing so race plays no part in my viewpoint but that doesnt mean i dont understand the dynamics.
If someone whines today that the caucasian community is seen suspiciously and in my instances, race is brought into the picture when it really isnt a race issue, i would like to have them look me in the eye and tell me that it is not a product of the last 500 years of caucasian machinations around the globe.
 

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