More blasphemy please

[nightprowler10]

actually the groundwork for terrorism was laid back in the 1980s when Pakistan was busy supporting the "jihad" and funneling billions of USDs (the generous US and Saudi grants) in setting up camps for these "freedom fighters". At that time President Reagan was busy comparing these Jihadis to the American founding fathers . But yes, that was the turning point and the start of factories churning out these "jihadis"

Yeah the point uvelocity brought up about it mainly being Muslims is a good one, but it ignores many historical aspects of the issue. I don't need to assume that the story wouldn't be much different if it was another group of underprivileged people that were being armed and used for a holy war. We've seen it happen numerous times in the past in European history alone. At the end of the day though, making excuses for these people doesn't fix anything, showing them how they're being used might, and there is certainly a lot of work being done in at least Pakistan regarding that. As AN pointed out though, it certainly doesn't make it easier with the war on terror. I liken it to the war on drugs, there's a good chance both of them are responsible for widely spreading for the very evil they're trying to stop.

[silentstriker]

Aren't a significant number of suicide bombers middle class, college educated, etc?

[smalishah84]

Aren't a significant number of suicide bombers middle class, college educated, etc?

I seriously doubt.

[smalishah84]

Yeah the point uvelocity brought up about it mainly being Muslims is a good one, but it ignores many historical aspects of the issue. I don't need to assume that the story wouldn't be much different if it was another group of underprivileged people that were being armed and used for a holy war. We've seen it happen numerous times in the past in European history alone. At the end of the day though, making excuses for these people doesn't fix anything, showing them how they're being used might, and there is certainly a lot of work being done in at least Pakistan regarding that. As AN pointed out though, it certainly doesn't make it easier with the war on terror. I liken it to the war on drugs, there's a good chance both of them are responsible for widely spreading for the very evil they're trying to stop.

good point

[Fusion]

Aren't a significant number of suicide bombers middle class, college educated, etc?

Not in Pakistan or Afghanistan. The overwhelming majority are young, extremely poor, and the only "education" they received was from a Madrasa. I don't know about other countries but it would shock me if it was any different there.

[smalishah84]

yep....apparently there was an article some time back in the Herald or maybe some other publication that you could actually go and buy suicide bombers near the Af-Pak border region for a pretty paltry amount and also for taking care of the bombers family afterwards. I don't remember the details of the article too clearly now but it came a few months after Benazir Bhutto's assassination.

[ganeshran]

It is disappointing to see the PPP which is a relatively liberal party pandering to the masses and playing the religion card to strenghten its own position at a time when it is under attack by the Supreme court in the Swiss letters and dual nationality cases.

Whenever a Pakistani government has tried to use religion to get out of a political mess, it ended up in an unmitigated disaster. Ayub Khan flirted with it, then Zia went in all out and now Zardari too.

[8ankitj]

Sad that the Pakistani politicians and government are pandering to the hardliners...

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

“We would go to the UN and OIC and get a law passed to stop anti-Islam activities, including blasphemy, for-ever,” he added. The prime minister said the Muslims have respect and reverence for all prophets and messengers of God and also other religions in the world. The Muslims expect that followers of other religions would reciprocate in the same way, he added. It was time to wage a diplomatic war with full sincerity and commitment until the international community is convinced to take concrete action including due legislation against all kinds of anti-Islam activities that provoke the sentiments of the Muslim world, Raja said.

Muslims have to live with the fact that there are going to be people in the world that don't respect their religion. You can't expect to wipe out the last voice of criticism. This is where I find the condemnation of violence rather week even from the Muslim liberals. It typically goes as - "The violence is deplorable and unjustified. Having said that...". No there's no having said that... It's not right to suppress expression of views against your religion. Critics are here to stay, and you yourselves need them (how else would Turkey be secular or some other country not force woman to wear hijab?). Some critics are going to be crude and "disrespectful", and you can't help it.

[smalishah84]

dude Ankit, if we had many sane voices around we wouldn't be in this mess

[ganeshran]

dude Ankit, if we had many sane voices around we wouldn't be in this mess

The PPP has always been pretty sane when it comes to religion. (its another matter that they are incompetent at governance). I dont recall such a stance ever being taken before by the leadership. I suspect its to divert attention from their incompetence and gain some brownie points in an election year

[smalishah84]

The PPP has always been pretty sane when it comes to religion. (its another matter that they are incompetent at governance). I dont recall such a stance ever being taken before by the leadership. I suspect its to divert attention from their incompetence and gain some brownie points in an election year

Dude, this is such an understatement. Their ineptitude is mind boggling. And they are so damn corrupt that you can feel the corruption in the air when they are in charge. You can cut it with a knife it so thick.

[Burgey]

Why isn't this minister in gaol for incitement to murder? Fmd what a terrible comment.

[Jono]

Its a friggin' disgrace.

[silentstriker]

Not in Pakistan or Afghanistan. The overwhelming majority are young, extremely poor, and the only "education" they received was from a Madrasa. I don't know about other countries but it would shock me if it was any different there.

Fair enough - I recall reading it from a reputable source but I could easily be misremembering it.

Another question, I saw Bill Maher yesterday (and I don't necessarily agree with him on this issue) and Salman Rushdie was on. He said that in the 70s and before, places like Tehran, Baghdad, Damascus, etc were very cosmopolitan and liberal cities (which is certainly true, by all contemporary accounts). I know the Iranian revolution was a big tipping point in the middle east, but what else do you think might have caused the big cultural change?

[smalishah84]

[QUOTE=silentstriker;2921764] I know the Iranian revolution was a big tipping point in the middle east, but what else do you think might have caused the big cultural change?[/QUOTE]

actually the groundwork for terrorism was laid back in the 1980s when Pakistan was busy supporting the "jihad" and funneling billions of USDs (the generous US and Saudi grants) in setting up camps for these "freedom fighters". At that time President Reagan was busy comparing these Jihadis to the American founding fathers . But yes, that was the turning point and the start of factories churning out these "jihadis"