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Thread: The Official Indian Politics Thread

  1. #526
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    Were they booked into jail with the general population? Unfortunately, those guys seem to have full diplomatic immunity, which sucks. Thankfully, the Indian diplomat didn't and she was treated exactly the way she should have been. If anything, they gave her more rights than a normal person in her position, which is regrettable.
    Last edited by silentstriker; 23-12-2013 at 09:51 AM.
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  2. #527
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ankitj View Post
    See, I understand what you are saying. Your condescending tone is disappointing. I am open to listening to you if you make a well reasoned argument.

    Yes, I am not for a minute saying that a maid can be thrown into a dungeon or made to work unreasonable number of hours per day. My argument strictly concerns the application of wage law. There should be more flexibility on what are the constituents of the wage paid in such cases, and also what kind of visas should have what kind of minimum wage requirement. I don't think that can be very hard to implement. You can have identical standards for this across all embassies to put a monetary value on all the constituents of the wage.
    We do. It's called the minimum wage. If you don't like it, don't hire a maid.

  3. #528
    International Captain ankitj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentstriker View Post
    We do. It's called the minimum wage. If you don't like it, don't hire a maid.
    Listen mate, if you want to pretend that you feel more strongly for human suffering than I do, you can go and talk to a wall. Get down of your high horse if you want to have a dialogue.

  4. #529
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    Many of us are actually in support of a higher minimum wage in the US. Why would we support actually lowering it for some people? It makes no sense. If the maid is working in the US, she is subject to the prices and cost of living of the US and she needs to be protected as an employee under the laws of the United States. It's that simple.


  5. #530
    Global Moderator Fusion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ankitj View Post
    See, I understand what you are saying. Your condescending tone is disappointing. I am open to listening to you if you make a well reasoned argument.

    Yes, I am not for a minute saying that a maid can be thrown into a dungeon or made to work unreasonable number of hours per day. My argument strictly concerns the application of wage law. There should be more flexibility on what are the constituents of the wage paid in such cases, and also what kind of visas should have what kind of minimum wage requirement. I don't think that can be very hard to implement. You can have identical standards for this across all embassies to put a monetary value on all the constituents of the wage.
    I don't intend to be condescending towards you, but those that exploit the vulnerable for their comfort. Ms. Devyani for example (IMO of course). Getting back to your point, you are attempting to separate two factors that are actually intrinsically linked when it comes to exploitation of labor. Abuse of labor doesn't just come from working long hours, but also from being underpaid. If you say that there should be more "flexibility" for wages, why can't someone argue there should be more flexibility about work hours or even safe working conditions? After all, a rich country's embassy can afford to comply with all workforce regulations that ensure safety of staff, whereas a poor country may not be able to. You can't pick and choose which aspects of the US labor laws you'll comply with. There has to be a uniform code that everyone must abide by and there should be no ambiguity about it.

    At the risk of sounding like a broken record, if an Embassy can't afford those regulations, or simply doesn't like them, then they should not hire maids/servants at all.

  6. #531
    Cricketer Of The Year Anil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fusion View Post
    At the risk of sounding like a broken record, if an Embassy can't afford those regulations, or simply doesn't like them, then they should not hire maids/servants at all.
    agreed with this...it was foolish at best for them to bring a maid to the u.s when they knew they couldn't pay her the minimum wages here...and her husband who was born and brought up here should have known that even if she didn't...

    slavery and human exploitation is rife in india...all i am saying is that calling this situation slave labor is pure hyperbole with not a lot of bearing on the reality of indian society...these kind of wage arrangements are extremely common in india where employers and servants negotiate wages based on work times, what they will do and what they will not along with fringe benefits like food, accommodation...etc...these negotiations and the arrangements have nothing to do with bonded labor or indentured servitude...the servants are free to look for better arrangements or leave when they want to...and having servants in india or other parts of asia is extremely common and it looks like this lady was so used to it that she was willing to risk breaking the law in a foreign country (assuming she knew what she was doing) in order to continue that lifestyle...
    Last edited by Anil; 23-12-2013 at 03:02 PM.
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  7. #532
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    It's pretty obvious she knew what she was doing considering the two separate contracts she drew up.

  8. #533
    Hall of Fame Member Cevno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentstriker View Post
    Were they booked into jail with the general population? Unfortunately, those guys seem to have full diplomatic immunity, which sucks. Thankfully, the Indian diplomat didn't and she was treated exactly the way she should have been. If anything, they gave her more rights than a normal person in her position, which is regrettable.
    There were officials of the same rank among the 45 odd accused and their spouses as well.

    You're position ignoring all facts is almost crazy extremist. Left Wing version of the Tea Party.

  9. #534
    Hall of Fame Member Cevno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentstriker View Post
    It's pretty obvious she knew what she was doing considering the two separate contracts she drew up.
    Already explained the contention raised here in detail.

    This is not a Exploitation issue at all due to currency, wage differential and additional benefits she got like food, lodging and extra expenses. That is the disputed part if you were to go into the actual case. Also, some payments were maid in India to her Husband allegedly which is again a technical point.


    Anyway, the contention is that she wanted to migrate to the US permanently and the allegation is that she even requested help in immigration + 10,000 dollars from the same diplomat before.

    Now with collusion of some US officials, she has played the system perfectly. Or you answer me who the hell is USA and this Preet Bharara to "rescue" people from India when Indian Courts are already looking at the matter ? And that too a family of a person that India officially had declared Persona non grata and revoked the passport off. USA should return her according to the rules after finding her, when she had dissapeared.

  10. #535
    Hall of Fame Member Cevno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentstriker View Post
    We do. It's called the minimum wage. If you don't like it, don't hire a maid.
    It won't happen as this matter will likely be solved through the backdoor but I do almost hope now that India showed more balls and went and charged all US diplomats for every violation of Indian law they can find (And there can be many in different states that they are posted), and put some in Indian jails if possible to just see you're and some in the American media reacting. Will you be towing the same line ?


    And Ftr, i hold no brief for this Devyani she may be in technical violation here of some law, and her family and she has corruption charges that they are facing in Adarsh society case in India as well. But these cases aren't handled this way. There's something called precedence of law and uniform application which maybe they should do then as well.
    Last edited by Cevno; 23-12-2013 at 08:36 PM.

  11. #536
    Cricketer Of The Year Anil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentstriker View Post
    It's pretty obvious she knew what she was doing considering the two separate contracts she drew up.
    ok sure...still doesn't follow that it is a case of exploitation or slave labor which is the only point i am bringing up here...

  12. #537
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cevno View Post
    There were officials of the same rank among the 45 odd accused and their spouses as well.

    You're position ignoring all facts is almost crazy extremist. Left Wing version of the Tea Party.
    Right. You're assuming I'd agree with not treating them like that. That assumption is false. If they are accused of crimes, I'm all for treating them like any other person who is accused of similar crimes.

  13. #538
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cevno View Post
    It won't happen as this matter will likely be solved through the backdoor but I do almost hope now that India showed more balls and went and charged all US diplomats for every violation of Indian law they can find (And there can be many in different states that they are posted), and put some in Indian jails if possible to just see you're and some in the American media reacting. Will you be towing the same line ?
    Yes I would, actually. If they are violating a law, they should be punished.

  14. #539
    The Wheel is Forever silentstriker's Avatar
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    Accused Indian diplomat needs US approval to work at UN mission | Fox News

    As I was saying, this transfer needs approval of the state department. I think they'll approve it to make the matter go away, even though I hope I'm wrong.

  15. #540
    Hall of Fame Member Cevno's Avatar
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    Was shaken to the core by 2002 riots, blogs Narendra Modi | NDTV.com


    Have extremely tough time believing any of this given actions and statements post 2002.

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