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Thread: St George's Day, that royal wedding, and the anthem

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    St George's Day, that royal wedding, and the anthem

    April 23 will be St George's Day, which is the day when we're supposed to take out our flags of St George and wave them, to show how English we are....

    But how English is St George himself? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't he a Turkish soldier who knew nothing of England? He seems to be a mythical character, much like Robin Hood and King Arthur, of whom we know little of nothing. For all we know, he could even be a fictional character, who never existed at all. I think the cross of St George was brought back from the Crusades by Richard the Lionheart, and eventually his popularity grew until the Hundred Years' War, when King Edward III adopted him as England's patron saint, while England became consumed with a sense of Englishness as they fought the French enemy. It seems that St George is nothing more than a display of jingoistic patriotism, with little redeeming factors about his legend, aside from the slaying of a mythical dragon.

    Before St George was adopted as England's patron saint, apparently St Edward the Confessor occupied that status. In the 13th century, King Henry III adopted this Saxon king as the patron saint, and had an unhealthy obsession with him, to the point that he gave his eldest son that Saxon name, at a time when it was vogue to use Norman names. Then, his great-grandson did away with Edward the Confessor, and embraced this shadowy St George.

    Wales and Ireland have St David and St Patrick respectively as their patron saints, which makes sense, because they're the missionaries who apparently converted those countries to Christianity. Scotland's ties with Andrew the apostle seems tenuous, but that's another story....

    Surely, the right thing to do is do away with this St George, and adopt Edward the Confessor as the patron saint. How pious he really was might be up for debate, but at least Edward the Confessor's English....

    In addition to changing the patron saint from St George to Edward the Confessor, maybe the time is right to change the national anthem....

    Is it necessary for the anthem to be religious in a country where most people are sceptical about religion? And surely, we should be trying to improve our own lives, rather than trying to 'save' some antiquated constitutional monarch. Most people only know the first verse, but what about the lines of the sixth verse?

    Lord grant that Marshal Wade
    May by thy mighty aid
    Victory bring
    May he sedition hush
    And like a torrent rush
    Rebellious Scots to crush

    Well then, I can understand if Scottish folk don't want to sing this anthem....

    Okay, I guess most national anthems have some religious theme, but give me a national anthem that doesn't hit us over the head with it, from the first line, or in the title, like 'God Save the Queen' or 'Jerusalem'. I would much rather sing along to 'Land of Hope and Glory'.

    I refuse to sing 'God Save the Queen', because I would rather call on God to save me, my family, my friends and countless strangers, rather than prostrate myself in front of some monarch who's descended from tyrants who's brutally suppressed, murdered and executed countless of English men and women.

    And this brings me to that annoying royal wedding....

    I object to my taxes being used to fund these in-bred upper class idiots in a lavish lifestyle in places like Buckingham Palace, which should really be turned into a museum to earn some money, instead of bleeding us dry like leeches. The maintainance of the royal family is like a justification of the despicable class system that pervades British society. Maybe the time is long overdue that the monarchy is replaced by a republic, with a non-executive president who's elected, and whose only purpose is to swear in the prime minister, and perform other ceremonial duties the Queen now performs. Trinidad has a non-executive president, and I'm sure he's cheaper to maintain than the British royal family.

    Okay, so maybe the royal family has a purpose - they're good for tourism. But if we have to keep them, we need to cut back our funding for them so dramatically, that we pay no more for their offices than, say, Trinidad would for their non-executive president. The monarch could perform the role of the president, but everyone else in this Windsor family should be forced to go out and look for jobs....

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    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    I object to my taxes funding the royal wedding too, after all I'm sure it's not putting anything back into the economy, given it will be watched my millions worldwide
    Last edited by GIMH; 19-04-2011 at 03:41 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeraintIsMyHero View Post


    I object to my taxes funding the royal wedding too, after all I'm sure it's not putting anything back into the economy, given it will be watched my millions worldwide
    So, if cockfighting is watched by millions worldwide, is it good, even though it involves the torture of animals?

    Just because millions like to watch it on television doesn't make it good. Look at Big Brother!

    I'm curious to hear what George Osborne says are the 'profits' earned by the wedding of Wills and Kate....

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    jan
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    I have always been a bit envious of the british royal tradition. We are historically egalitarian and antimonarchist society. Apart from the "founding father" who lead us to our independence all the other heads of state are being considered assholes. Mostly because they were/are assholes and acted despicably. Seeing this future king of yours is refreshing view for me as he seems smart, well-behaved, competent and sovereign-like. Id wave a flag on St George's Day I guess.

    I imagine its pretty expensive to feed the royal beast but still it is imho great tradition and something the British seem proud of...dont you? General public isnt against monarchy to the point they would like to see it abolished, are they?

    And I like that chick whos gonna marry your soon-bald prince


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    Cricketer Of The Year four_or_six's Avatar
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    Don't really care about the wedding, but the day off is awesome. You only have to take three days holiday and you get 11 days out of work.

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    Cricketer Of The Year four_or_six's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jan View Post
    I imagine its pretty expensive to feed the royal beast but still it is imho great tradition and something the British seem proud of...dont you? General public isnt against monarchy to the point they would like to see it abolished, are they?
    Not sure about proud of, but much better William than whoever we'd probably get if we had to vote them in. Someone like Sarkozy, Bush, Berlusconi etc...

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    All it is the forerunner of celebrity gossip culture. Televising the royal wedding is just a glorified version of the weddings that get covered by Hello magazine. It's just seen as higher than that because it's older. Personally, I'm not interested.
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    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shivfan View Post
    So, if cockfighting is watched by millions worldwide, is it good, even though it involves the torture of animals?

    Just because millions like to watch it on television doesn't make it good. Look at Big Brother!

    I'm curious to hear what George Osborne says are the 'profits' earned by the wedding of Wills and Kate....
    hey straw man. What the hell does torture of animals have to do with this? Are your taxes paying for that? No so where's the relevance.

    I don't care about the royal wedding but don't resent my taxes going on it because a global audience will surely earn more than the amount spent on it. That was my point but you felt the need to spout a pile of ****.

    You're not the only person who doesn't like the government but **** me you definitely come up with the worst reasons to bash it.

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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Pfft.

    Point of order, Mr Speaker.

    The previous patron saint was St Edmund (AKA Edmund the Martyr), a 9th century king of East Anglia.

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    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Cricket Web Staff Member / Global Moderator Neil Pickup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by four_or_six View Post
    Don't really care about the wedding, but the day off is awesome. You only have to take three days holiday and you get 11 days out of work.
    You might. We don't. We also get to watch it with all the children who will probably want to be there as much as I do. It would actually be interesting to see some figures on civil list spending before we get sucked into an argument built on sand. Yes, this is going to boost the economy, but what about the other years - how much do we cough up on the civil list annually?
    Last edited by Neil Pickup; 19-04-2011 at 05:23 AM.
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    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Wtf, why isn't it the Easter holidays?

    And surely you should get a public holiday anyway?

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    Cricket Web Staff Member / Global Moderator Neil Pickup's Avatar
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    Our holidays are crazy this year. We finished on March 31, we're back Tuesday April 26 and the kids are back Thursday April 28. We do need to be back, I suppose, as our first cricket match of the season is April 30...

    We then work non-stop, both Bank Holidays included, (and it will be non-stop in my case as Sunday will be spent wondering how exactly so many nine-year-olds can get lost at Legoland). until the weekend 7/8 May - which I'll be spending camping at Symonds Yat - and then have another three weeks until half term. I will be using each of my Sundays for county games so it will basically be 32 days "on" in a row.

    Woo-hoo. I thoroughly expect I'll then use my first day off to go and play Division 9 cricket or something...

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    More navel gazing from an ossified, has-been nation.
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    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burgey View Post
    More navel gazing from an ossified, has-been nation.
    Says the main who emailed me asking if I knew any way I'd be able to get him into the ceremony

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