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Thread: The British Politics Thread

  1. #16
    cpr
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    Yeah, talk of a snap poll has been milling around since Brown came to office. Although he's ahead in polls at the moment, an election would be a tight thing. Although the public see Brown as the start of a new era now, an election campaign would see tories drag up all the Blair mistakes, which Brown was a central part of. Cameron is Conservative leader on the grounds of his public appearance, and an election is what he needs at the moment, his only way to get in the public eye at the moment is to announce new policies, which open him up for criticism, An election would guarantee 6 weeks of easy media.

    Brown needs a blitz on the opening of Parliament, then call an election for January. He cant guarantee a win on name alone at the moment, but a quick run of success would give him what he needs. If he leaves it too long then any old Tony problems could come and bite him
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  2. #17
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    A poll today in The Times put Labour 10pts clear of the Tories. I think that represents the ex-Labour voters who are encouraged by the change in leader.

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by gio View Post
    A poll today in The Times put Labour 10pts clear of the Tories. I think that represents the ex-Labour voters who are encouraged by the change in leader.
    That and how incredibly stupid Britain is.

    This bunch got incredibly lucky with the economy (inherited and global economies pretty much ensured things have gone smoothly), sneakily taxed the living snot out of everyone and have failed to improve anything with all that extra money. It's truly embarrassing how people can still vote for them.

    People we don't know are incompetent is surely better than people we know are utterly clueless beyond any shadow of a doubt.
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  4. #19
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    Yeah the tax is annoying, i'm moving abroad as soon as i can afford it.

    economy's gonna be fun, especially with the big collapse in American mortgages, got a feeling that could have a knock on with the housing market here, though its hard to tell at this time of year, its always slow in August as everyones away (hence why i can get away with all the posting i was doing today)


  5. #20
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    Whilst I disagree with a lot of what Labour has done, their investment and commitment towards eliminating third world debt is commendable. They have done more than any previous government concerning this issue, and I hope that future governments can continue their work.

    You musn't forget that Labour also reduced homelessness and unemployment, whilst also introducing a minimum wage. Whilst their educational and health service reforms are questionable, I don't think they are as bad as being made out by many media outlets, and I doubt if the Tories would have done much better.

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by gio View Post
    Whilst I disagree with a lot of what Labour has done, their investment and commitment towards eliminating third world debt is commendable. They have done more than any previous government concerning this issue, and I hope that future governments can continue their work.

    You musn't forget that Labour also reduced homelessness and unemployment, whilst also introducing a minimum wage. Whilst their educational and health service reforms are questionable, I don't think they are as bad as being made out by many media outlets, and I doubt if the Tories would have done much better.

    Yea, as an ex-student who has been slapped with 12 grand worth of student loan I'll have to repay I really appreciate their work with third world debt. Then there's the way the private student loan companies harass registered mentally ill, disabled people like my sister and threaten to take them to court. But then the sick and needy in this country are a very long way down the list when it comes to this Labour government, except for when they're a statistic like the homeless (I'm very skeptical of any figures this lot throws up anyway).

    As for unemploment figures, I'd wager most of this is down to the way full time jobs become two or three part time jobs. The companies like it because part time workers have crap all rights, the governments like it because it helps their statistics. Some more of the unemployed have simply been moved onto the sick where as far as I'm aware they get exactly the same money as they do if they were seeking employment.

    As for all the reforms, Labour likes to make it look like they're actually doing something. Of course all they've managed to do is piss everyone involved off for no benefit whatsoever - in fact things get worse because of the unfamiliarity of the new systems, guidelines etc.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    Yea, as an ex-student who has been slapped with 12 grand worth of student loan I'll have to repay I really appreciate their work with third world debt. Then there's the way the private student loan companies harass registered mentally ill, disabled people like my sister and threaten to take them to court. But then the sick and needy in this country are a very long way down the list when it comes to this Labour government, except for when they're a statistic like the homeless (I'm very skeptical of any figures this lot throws up anyway).
    I'm sorry to hear about your sister being harassed. But I fail to see how the labour government were responsible for it.

    As for unemploment figures, I'd wager most of this is down to the way full time jobs become two or three part time jobs. The companies like it because part time workers have crap all rights, the governments like it because it helps their statistics. Some more of the unemployed have simply been moved onto the sick where as far as I'm aware they get exactly the same money as they do if they were seeking employment.
    Surely any employment is better than unemployment, part time or otherwise. You are learning skills and learning about the working environment. You have the chance of promotion through the business and the chance to go full time. Also, as far as I'm aware, employment benefit currently stands around £40 a week. That equates to under 8 hours work on the minimum wage. I'd be surpised if there are many jobs that employ staff to work less than 8 hours.

    I'm sorry to say I'm not aware of the inferior rights part time workers have over full time workers, so I can't comment on that issue.

    As for all the reforms, Labour likes to make it look like they're actually doing something. Of course all they've managed to do is piss everyone involved off for no benefit whatsoever - in fact things get worse because of the unfamiliarity of the new systems, guidelines etc.
    I don't know the ins and outs of the NHS and education reforms so I'm not in a position to give a confident opinion. What I will say is that foundation hospitals are a mistake and I hope Labour realises this soon. Also, the new application system regarding doctors has obviously been implemented very poorly and rightly, heads have rolled.

  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by gio View Post
    I'm sorry to hear about your sister being harassed. But I fail to see how the labour government were responsible for it.
    It is they who made the decision to leave some student loans in the hands of unscrupulous private companies.

    Quote Originally Posted by gio
    Surely any employment is better than unemployment, part time or otherwise. You are learning skills and learning about the working environment. You have the chance of promotion through the business and the chance to go full time. Also, as far as I'm aware, employment benefit currently stands around £40 a week. That equates to under 8 hours work on the minimum wage. I'd be surpised if there are many jobs that employ staff to work less than 8 hours.
    I don't see how it is better to split full time jobs into multiple part time jobs. Particularly when you see people end up having to take multiple part time jobs anyway. There needs to be a balance between part time and full time jobs.

  9. #24
    cpr
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    The unemployment figures are a fun statistic calulated by an office junior mashing a calculator.

    Best thing to do with the student loan company is enter your details wrong. They then cant match your details to a NI number... will still pay into your bank account untill its sorted though. Never chased me up for £4,000 after they cocked up by date of birth one year, do still chase up the other £3,000 though.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    As for unemploment figures, I'd wager most of this is down to the way full time jobs become two or three part time jobs. The companies like it because part time workers have crap all rights, the governments like it because it helps their statistics. Some more of the unemployed have simply been moved onto the sick where as far as I'm aware they get exactly the same money as they do if they were seeking employment.
    I've no love for the current government, but strictly speaking anyone who's job is less than 16 hours per week is still technically unemployed, so splitting full time jobs up wouldn't have any affect on the figures.

    & the exact reverse is true about people being moved onto sickness benefits. In fact one of our big current directives is to make more of the long-term "sick" become what the government calls "economically active" (working or claiming a benefit that suggests they're ready to take a job).

    The reason why we have low unemployment figures is that there's loads of jobs to be had. The UK has successfully absorbed X-hundred thousand citizens of the former Eastern bloc (officially 400,000, realistically three times that) who have all come here to work. If we didn't have the jobs they wouldn't come. Whether the government can take credit for this is another issue.
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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby
    I've no love for the current government, but strictly speaking anyone who's job is less than 16 hours per week is still technically unemployed, so splitting full time jobs up wouldn't have any affect on the figures.
    Haha, and to think in Australia they treat anyone who has done one hour of work in the past week as "employed".

  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    I've no love for the current government, but strictly speaking anyone who's job is less than 16 hours per week is still technically unemployed, so splitting full time jobs up wouldn't have any affect on the figures.

    & the exact reverse is true about people being moved onto sickness benefits. In fact one of our big current directives is to make more of the long-term "sick" become what the government calls "economically active" (working or claiming a benefit that suggests they're ready to take a job).

    The reason why we have low unemployment figures is that there's loads of jobs to be had. The UK has successfully absorbed X-hundred thousand citizens of the former Eastern bloc (officially 400,000, realistically three times that) who have all come here to work. If we didn't have the jobs they wouldn't come. Whether the government can take credit for this is another issue.
    A lot of part time jobs are 16 hours are longer, so splitting them will have an affect on figures.

    As for the directive... where was it in the past 10 years? What will probably happen is they'll shove people who're unfit for work off benefits and leave the conmen alone, but we'll wait and see what comes of it - whether it's just hot air or whatever.

    As for all the Eastern bloc coming in... they're taking jobs OFF the natives because they're cheaper, Polish builders anyone? They come over here because the money is still better than back home.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    As for all the Eastern bloc coming in... they're taking jobs OFF the natives because they're cheaper, Polish builders anyone?
    How many people do you know personally who can't get a job for all the immigrants?

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    A lot of part time jobs are 16 hours are longer, so splitting them will have an affect on figures.

    As for the directive... where was it in the past 10 years? What will probably happen is they'll shove people who're unfit for work off benefits and leave the conmen alone, but we'll wait and see what comes of it - whether it's just hot air or whatever.
    A lot of it is bull****, frankly, but the govt likes to be seen to be doing something. Simplest way to reduce sickness benefit is don't pay it for bad backs or "stress": bang - 85% gone at one stroke.

    The trouble is that that would punish the genuine sufferers of those conditions, so the department favours a softly-softly approach.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    As for all the Eastern bloc coming in... they're taking jobs OFF the natives because they're cheaper, Polish builders anyone? They come over here because the money is still better than back home.
    There's some truth in that; immigrants are pricing the native unskilled working-class out of the market to some extent. However what is also true is that they're prepared to do jobs that the natives won't. Round here we have literally thousands of seasonal agricultural jobs: picking & packing crops, essentially. It's **** pay & bloody hard work so the local unemployed (largely feckless ****s it must be said) won't touch the jobs. Poles, Lithunanians & Latvians lap them up.

  15. #30
    cpr
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    As for all the Eastern bloc coming in... they're taking jobs OFF the natives because they're cheaper, Polish builders anyone? They come over here because the money is still better than back home.
    Actually there not cheaper, they get payed the same minimum wage as everyone else. Just there more willing to work at that level. We use a Polish builder for a lot of our maintenance work, as he's fair priced and will do the job a damn site quicker than many local builders (and that includes my uncles!). His invoices make it all the worth while though, as although his spoken English is perfect, his spelling isnt, so a 'Window leaking in the porch' becomes 'Window licking in the porshe'

    Theres a lot of immigration into this country because A) we have a damn good minimum wage and B) theres alot of work available for those willing. Anyone claiming they cant geta job due to foreigners can just get out of the country IMO. Not looking hard enough (i've not had a permanent job for over a year, spent all my time temping, never gone a week without a position, as theres always jobs for those who are reliable and work hard)

    Flipside of this though, although they arnt taking anyones jobs, they are having an effect on housing. Councils will house 'homeless' immigrants as a priority, which means brits needing the houses lose out. (girlfriends mums in that position, She has 3 children, in a 2 bedroom house, been told its a 5 year wait for a bigger house if she's lucky, as she's not a priority case). Couple this with the whole 'Right to Buy' means that the number of council properties has rapidly dimished, whilst the demand has grown. (i do agree with Right to buy, just think the council should put that money straight back into building/purchasing more houses to replace)

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