The Australian politics thread

[Craig]

Originally Posted by Son Of Coco

Yeah, in Saudi Arabia it's about 38c a litre. It's amazing that the fuel companies are at the mercy of the oil companies when it comes to prices, yet it goes up on such a regular cycle that freakishly mirrors peak buying times for consumers. Keeping an eye on barrel prices and making fuel companies charge accordingly was a good step too in my opinion. They were only caught out once or twice, but I'd prefer them to know they're being watched. Even if there's not a great deal that can be done most of the time.

I think it is fair to say the ACCC is about as useful as tits on a bull. Agree?

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by Craig

I think it is fair to say the ACCC is about as useful as tits on a bull. Agree?

haha, yes.

[Johnners]

Originally Posted by Samuel_Vimes

Depends what you get the ethanol from. Most of it's from palm oil apparently - still, if you want to grow that in Australia, you use up land which could have been used to grow food. Either that, or you buy palm oil from Malaysia - fair nuff, that has little effect on food production, but is remarkably unsustainable all the same. Plus, if you want to "invest" in biofuels, then you have to increase production of the stuff that ethanol is made from, and you either do that by using up Australian agricultural land or chopping down Malaysian indigenous forest, most of which is burned to make way for the plantation.

In western countries, the vast majority of crops that are used to produce ethanol, are actually feed crops (I.E. crops grown for livestock purposes) which really doesn't effect food production. If say, you produce 1000 tons of feed corn, and sell that to an Ethanol plant, you actually get between 500-700 ton of "waste" which is then mixed up into high protein feed mix for livestock. So really, it isn't going to have any significant effect on food prices.

As for using up land that could have been used to grow food, whilst you are correct in that the land could be use to produce food, it shouldn't be. By producing more food, all you're going to do is over supply the market, which will then cause the price to fall through the floor, which then in turn, sends the primary producers broke, and that isn't exactly going to help because who will then grow the food? Also, but stopping producing other resources (eg. Cotton) in order to produce more food, all you're going to do is then cause a shortage of supply in that resource, which is just going to cause more problems.

[Johnners]

Originally Posted by Son Of Coco

Aren't they looking at fuel prices as a whole? There's no way diesel should be more expensive than normal fuel. Not so long ago it was a lot cheaper. The only way it'll ever be completely fair in my opinion is if we could make our own fuel...the sob stories about fuel companies being at the mercy of this that and the other are crap. What's their annual profit? We could lose some excise off fuel too.

I'm not exactly convinced they are looking at fuel prices as a whole, because everything I've heard mentioned over the past few weeks has been about "petrol prices". Oh, and I assume you mean petrol when you're talking about "normal fuel"

IMO the diesel price is actually partially subsidising the petrol price (which is why it's dearer) in order to increase political popularity.

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by Clapo

I'm not exactly convinced they are looking at fuel prices as a whole, because everything I've heard mentioned over the past few weeks has been about "petrol prices". Oh, and I assume you mean petrol when you're talking about "normal fuel"

IMO the diesel price is actually partially subsidising the petrol price (which is why it's dearer) in order to increase political popularity.

And this has been happening for years? Given that diesel has steadily overtaken fuel over a period of time...

I think those driving diesel relics, I mean...vehicles , should be extremely pissed off as there's absolutely no reason why diesel should be more expensive. Although there is the part where more people started driving diesel vehicles because they were cheaper to run. That was easily fixed!

[vic_orthdox]

Originally Posted by Son Of Coco

I'd say things like fuel jumping by 12+ cents a litre between the morning and afternoon would come into it. All they're trying to do is make sure people know what they will be charged over a 24 hour period for fuel. You'll be able to find out where the cheapest fuel for that 24 hour period is in your area. Given the sum total done about fuel prices in the last 10 years is 0, I'm up for anything that might have an effect. We all know it'll go up sometime between Wednesday lunchtime and Wed night and stay up until everyone's bought their fuel doing weekend trips before it goes back down on Tuesday morning/lunchtime for a day.

What would you call fair?

Gah, just get your petrol on a Tuesday. Everyone knows that it'll rise after that. Now they'll just keep it rising with this new thing.

[Johnners]

Originally Posted by Son Of Coco

And this has been happening for years? Given that diesel has steadily overtaken fuel over a period of time...

I think those driving diesel relics, I mean...vehicles , should be extremely pissed off as there's absolutely no reason why diesel should be more expensive. Although there is the part where more people started driving diesel vehicles because they were cheaper to run. That was easily fixed!

Haha tbf, those diesel relics, are actually starting to become the more efficient vehicles to run (newer diesels, obviously)

[Burgey]

Originally Posted by Son Of Coco

Yeah, in Saudi Arabia it's about 38c a litre. It's amazing that the fuel companies are at the mercy of the oil companies when it comes to prices, yet it goes up on such a regular cycle that freakishly mirrors peak buying times for consumers. Keeping an eye on barrel prices and making fuel companies charge accordingly was a good step too in my opinion. They were only caught out once or twice, but I'd prefer them to know they're being watched. Even if there's not a great deal that can be done most of the time.

Yeah but if you get out of your car and dig about 3 feet into the sand in Saudi you hit oil. Apples and oranges.

Look, it's all politics - the government has to be seen to be trying something. Whether it ultimately works or not, they can face the electorate and say, with their hands on their hearts, "We tried our best. Our predecessors didn't even acknowledge the problem".

[Johnners]

Angry voter eats ballot paper in protest

Interesting way to protest.

[Burgey]

They change governments so often in Italy, the bloke will eat like a King!!!

[Johnners]

Actually, the article says that the Prime Minister (or President?) who won the election, was now sitting his 3rd term. That's hardly changing governments often

[vic_orthdox]

Nah, it's his third term, but he's been in opposition for the last term. Lost the election prior to this one.

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by Burgey

Yeah but if you get out of your car and dig about 3 feet into the sand in Saudi you hit oil. Apples and oranges.

Look, it's all politics - the government has to be seen to be trying something. Whether it ultimately works or not, they can face the electorate and say, with their hands on their hearts, "We tried our best. Our predecessors didn't even acknowledge the problem".

Exactly, which explains the shortages that we are occasionally told are what effects our oil prices. Obviously the Saudi's are going to want to make money off it though.

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by vic_orthdox

Gah, just get your petrol on a Tuesday. Everyone knows that it'll rise after that. Now they'll just keep it rising with this new thing.

Yeah, that works if you don't have to drive a long way for work each week and don't have kids to drive around on the weekend to sporting fixtures etc.

'Just get your petrol on Tuesday' is basically the short way of saying 'I can't be ****ed doing anything about it because it'll never change...they've got us by the balls'

I can't believe they can't even get credit for at least trying something. BRING BACK THE GUYS THAT DID NOTHING! TAX CUTS! TAX CUTS!

[Johnners]