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Thread: quote Making a case for the injured mind unquote

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    State Vice-Captain jot1's Avatar
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    quote Making a case for the injured mind unquote

    James Tighe, clinical nurse research fellow said:
    "Everyone feels a bit low sometimes - it's the mental health equivalent of the common cold. But for some people it's much more serious, paralysing their ability to get on with life."
    How common is it?
    Seven to 12 per cent of men suffer from diagnosable depression, and 20 to 25 per cent of women. One in four of us will have some sort of mental health problem in their life. This means there are millions of people in the world who are either encountering problems themselves or know someone else who is experiencing them.
    Australia's Michael Slater revealed he suffered from the manic depressive disease, which causes large mood swings and can even lead to suicide, and was worried about how his announcement would be received. The threat of admitting weakness has lasted much longer than his playing days. Society says injury-induced retirees are glorified; those with sick minds are signed off as nutcases.
    "Are people going to think I'm a fruit loop," he asked Enough Rope's Andrew Denton as he shared his secret. Twenty percent of Australians experience some sort of mental illness, yet an opening batsman who thrilled and spilled in a Test career of 71 Tests, scoring 5312 runs at 42.83, was more cautious – scared even – than facing Ambrose and Walsh at their fastest.
    http://pak.cricinfo.com/link_to_data...17MAR2005.html
    The reason I'm posting this is because it stands to reason that at least some percentage of the membership here must either suffer or have suffered from this illness or know someone who did or does. What would you do about it? Either for yourself or a family member or friend? Do you believe people can be helped and would you stand by them even when they are at their most difficult? Slater was let down not only by the cricket community as a whole, but also his fellow cricketers and supporting staff. He was villified by the press for his erratic behaviour, which is a symtom of the desease. BTW some forms of the disease is genetic like diabetes, etc. People are born with it. Or do you think these people are "fruit loops" and don't want anything to do with them?

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    Cricketer Of The Year Robertinho's Avatar
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    Bipolar disorder? Or just general depression? I think depression is hard to diagnose - we all have our bad days, though it doesn't necessarily mean we're depressed.

    However, I do know someone with bipolar, he's an idiot in my opinion, never liked him. (Unfortunately) he has that effect on people, and thus it only contributes to his disorder. A shame, though as a person he's not very likeable.
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    It was Bipolar 2 for those of you playing at home.
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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    It's v brave of Slater to make his illness public. I wonder if Paul Hester's recent suicide had any part in his decision? I don't know for a fact if Hester was diagnosed as bi-polar, but from the tributes to him I've read his behaviour would seem to be consistent with it. Unfortunately there is a perception amongst the public that mental illnesses aren't somehow as serious as physical ailments. The idea that suffers can just snap out of it & are being self-indulgent contributes to the conspiracy of silence that surrounds mental illness.

    That said, as someone who works in the administration of state benefits I have to say depression and/or stress are incredibly open to abuse by dishonest claimants. Older colleagues call them "the bad back of the noughties". As medical science has caught up with treatment of the back there has been a massive increase in the diagnosis of stress/depression. Unfortunately, due to constraints of time & money on our NHS, it is often easier for an overworked GP to write a medical certificate out for recidivists than to go through the time & money consuming process of trying to prove that they're swinging the lead.

    This abuse by the unscrupulous of course adds to the public's perception that all suffers are self-indulgent & work-shy. Real cases are tarred with the same brush.
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    International Captain Slow Love™'s Avatar
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    That article at cricinfo is a fairly stupid piece. I can see why Slater was reluctant to spill the beans though, because there's still a great deal of stigma attached.

    I had a friend of eleven years who suffered from depression long-term, and who ultimately ended his life. We were like brothers, and when he died, it was a terrible thing. Some people he knew dismissed him as being a loser, or selfish, for doing what he did. IMO, his decision deserved respect, even if I wish he had been able to be helped - and let's just say that the way he did it took a lot more bravery than many of us will ever summon. Yes, this might seem a strange thing to say.

    Do I think that everybody can be helped? No, I don't, although I would encourage anybody to exhaust as many options to attempt to improve things as possible, before they made any decisions of finality. But some things aren't possible to be fixed, and maybe people need to understand that too, so we don't consider people in this situation to be automatically failures (pejoratively) or lazy, cowardly, etc.

    There are people who drive others away though. I knew a guy who was paranoid schizophrenic, and at a certain point, his violent tendencies meant I (and others) could no longer tolerate his company. Sometimes life is like that (an ex-girlfriend once told me that he ended up stalking Ten newsreader Sandra Sully - I have no idea if it was true or not, but it didn't seem out of the realms of possibility). I've certainly known other people with mental illnesses (it's not that rare, after all), and they're people like anybody else - in fact, most people probably have some kind of neurosis, it's just a matter of how much it tends to influence your life. I think a lot of people have an understanding of the difficulties being bipolar, schizophrenic, delusional entail - depression is still a condition that a lot of people don't recognize as being "legitimate" though

    Also, I don't really care if someone is "born with it" or not. I think in some ways that it's a shame we have to define things this way for people to have a shred of empathy for somebody.
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    Soutie Langeveldt's Avatar
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    Interesting... Personally, I am a right moody tosser on the cricket field, very abrasive and hard to reason with when the chips are down, I dread to think what kind of emotions a test player must go through.. However, I hope I never let that into the rest of my life, I have certainly never been told I carry my problem into every day life..

    I bring this up, maybe because Slats was passed off as being just a bit of a tosser on the pitch, unbeknownst to everyone that he had more major issues.. Sport does weird things to people, sometimes when more serious ones arise they go un-noticed..
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    State Vice-Captain jot1's Avatar
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    Found this list of famous people (still living) known to suffer from bi-polar disorder, many more not living anymore. I was surprised by the names on the lists.(living and not):
    Robin Williams (actor, comedian) Peter Gabriel (musician) Ted Turner (entrepreneuer)
    Idi Amin (former dictator) Charles Haley (former football athlete) Spike Mulligan (comic actor)
    Patty Duke (actor, writer) Axl Rose (musician) Abigail Padgett (mystery writer)
    Connie Francis (actor, musician) Kristy McNichols (actor) Murray Pezim (financer, Canada)
    Barret Robbins (C, Oakland Raiders) (H) Charley Pride (musician)

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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jot1
    Found this list of famous people (still living) known to suffer from bi-polar disorder, many more not living anymore. I was surprised by the names on the lists.(living and not):
    Robin Williams (actor, comedian) Peter Gabriel (musician) Ted Turner (entrepreneuer)
    Idi Amin (former dictator) Charles Haley (former football athlete) Spike Mulligan (comic actor)
    Patty Duke (actor, writer) Axl Rose (musician) Abigail Padgett (mystery writer)
    Connie Francis (actor, musician) Kristy McNichols (actor) Murray Pezim (financer, Canada)
    Barret Robbins (C, Oakland Raiders) (H) Charley Pride (musician)
    I haven't heard of half of them! I knew about Spike, who was refreshingly honest about his manic depression, but Robin Williams is a surprise.

    Others I know of are Stan Collymore (English footballer), Kristin Hersh (lead singer of Throwing Muses) & Elizabeth Wurtzel (Prozac Nation author).

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    Soutie Langeveldt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jot1
    Found this list of famous people (still living) known to suffer from bi-polar disorder, many more not living anymore. I was surprised by the names on the lists.(living and not):
    Robin Williams (actor, comedian)
    Interesting.. I never knew, but his screen persona makes him come across as someone probably more likely to have it in my eyes.. (Weird way of putting it)

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    Hall of Fame Member Smudge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby
    It's v brave of Slater to make his illness public. I wonder if Paul Hester's recent suicide had any part in his decision? .
    I doubt it as Slater has been public with his illness for a couple of months at least.

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    International Regular chris.hinton's Avatar
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    This is quite Interesting

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    PY
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    I once had a discussion with someone who said that depression wasn't an illness, it was just a state of mind which could be changed by circumstances and experiences but couldn't be cured by medical means or helped by medical means.

    This guy has a PhD to do with Human Psychology (focused in on the part of the brain that revolves around longterm emotions I think he said) and I said he was nuts and almost everyone around me agreed. Maybe it was his abrasive personality (lovely guy in front of a lectern but ferocious behind one) which made his ideas seem so outlandish and fundamentally wrong.

    Now I've learned a little bit more about it, I'm not sure whether he was wrong. Can it be described as an illness when it has no medical definition and can it be cured by drugs because I'm under impression they just suppress the problem rather than solving it? Far from certain about these but I'm just firing things around.

    Thoughts?
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    Soutie Langeveldt's Avatar
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    Im of the opinion that its a long term state of mind (not an illness or disease) that can be subdued/altered by medication..

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    PY
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    PS He also asked questions about what we should do if we have a close friend who suffers from a form of depression and they are considering hurting themselves. We, as a large group of 20ish year olds, couldn't come up with what we could say was a full answer. Do you recommend they get help from doctors? Pshrinks? Do you just offer them your support and guidance? But if you offer guidance, how do you know that it is the right thing but they won't listen to anyone else?

    Then what emotions would/should you feel when someone does something to themselves or others? Should you feel partially responsible as they are your friend even though you gave advice and it just didn't help or should you feel that could have done no more than give them advice and support but leave them to their own devices?

    A LOT of girls in the group found it pretty distressing to think about these things and the questions they bring and they aren't things that I like to think on either but I had my views at the time which I'm not certain are correct or whether I still believe them.

    Most of all, I'm just not qualified to comment.

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    International Captain Deja moo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PY
    I once had a discussion with someone who said that depression wasn't an illness, it was just a state of mind which could be changed by circumstances and experiences but couldn't be cured by medical means or helped by medical means.

    This guy has a PhD to do with Human Psychology (focused in on the part of the brain that revolves around longterm emotions I think he said) and I said he was nuts and almost everyone around me agreed. Maybe it was his abrasive personality (lovely guy in front of a lectern but ferocious behind one) which made his ideas seem so outlandish and fundamentally wrong.

    Now I've learned a little bit more about it, I'm not sure whether he was wrong. Can it be described as an illness when it has no medical definition and can it be cured by drugs because I'm under impression they just suppress the problem rather than solving it? Far from certain about these but I'm just firing things around.

    Thoughts?
    I kind of agree with the assessment in the first para there. Drugs do help to an extent , but only in masking some of the symptoms temporarily. Long term cure can only lie in resolution of the cause and/or in psychological counselling. The powers of denial and obfuscation in relieving such illnesses when satisfactory resolution of root cause is improbable are pretty strong, I reckon too.
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