What are prisons for?

[nookie_lk]

What do u think ? (c/o skynews.com)

[Mr Casson]

I think they can be for both. If they weren't for rehabilitation, prisoners would not be released into mainstream society. However, there are those who are sentenced to death or life imprisonment, and these people are definitely being punished.

[lord_of_darkness]

Prisons are for where men meet men..

[Deja moo]

^ Yeh, just dont drop the soap..

[Slow Love™]

You left off the most important aspect off the poll: protection of the population. Although I'm aware that many people consider vicarious revenge on criminals a priority.

Here are the purposes I believe prisons should serve, in order:

1) Protection of the population
2) Deterrence (I prefer to put it this way rather than punishment. To be frank, I think prisons should do their best to uphold civil rights, and should not turn into hellholes, so comfortable cells and TVs are totally OK as far as I'm concerned. Taking away somebody's liberty is enough "punishment" for me.)
3) Rehabilitation

[Mr Casson]

Originally Posted by Slow Love™

2) Deterrence (I prefer to put it this way rather than punishment. To be frank, I think prisons should do their best to uphold civil rights, and should not turn into hellholes, so comfortable cells and TVs are totally OK as far as I'm concerned. Taking away somebody's liberty is enough "punishment" for me.)

I can see your point, but do you not think that it's a bit like parents telling their kid to go to their room when they've got means to keep themself entertained? It takes away the desired effect in my opinion. Also, there are many deadbeats in society who would love to go to a prison where meals, TV and a bed are provided. Even homeless people might resort to crime just to get into prison where they are looked after. It's just a bit dangerous, but that's only my opinion.

[Slow Love™]

Originally Posted by Mr Casson

I can see your point, but do you not think that it's a bit like parents telling their kid to go to their room when they've got means to keep themself entertained? It takes away the desired effect in my opinion. Also, there are many deadbeats in society who would love to go to a prison where meals, TV and a bed are provided. Even homeless people might resort to crime just to get into prison where they are looked after. It's just a bit dangerous, but that's only my opinion.

Well, in terms of somebody wanting a bed and meals, prison's ALWAYS offered that - are you advocating sticking them in a cage with a hole to crap in?

The main argument against the idea of deliberately brutalizing inmates in a prison is the fact that it's a large variety of people that are incarcerated. There are people that didn't pay fines, there are people that embezzled, there are people in their late teens that stole a car to joyride, and there are people there that rape grandmothers and murder people without a second thought.

Ensuring that the conditions in a jail are subhuman, or as harsh as is possible, just ensures that those sent there who are not already inhuman monsters have a damn good chance of becoming one. Or, just as bad, people who have made a mistake in their life have the chance to be brutalized by other inmates (or, even their keepers) - in which case you are directly rewarding the monsters, and penalising those that have a chance of making something of their lives.

I'm not saying that prisons should be pleasure palaces, or places of leisure, but we should treat the people within them in a humane fashion.

[Mr Casson]

Originally Posted by Slow Love™

Well, in terms of somebody wanting a bed and meals, prison's ALWAYS offered that - are you advocating sticking them in a cage with a hole to crap in?

The main argument against the idea of deliberately brutalizing inmates in a prison is the fact that it's a large variety of people that are incarcerated. There are people that didn't pay fines, there are people that embezzled, there are people in their late teens that stole a car to joyride, and there are people there that rape grandmothers and murder people without a second thought.

Ensuring that the conditions in a jail are subhuman, or as harsh as is possible, just ensures that those sent there who are not already inhuman monsters have a damn good chance of becoming one. Or, just as bad, people who have made a mistake in their life have the chance to be brutalized by other inmates (or, even their keepers) - in which case you are directly rewarding the monsters, and penalising those that have a chance of making something of their lives.

I'm not saying that prisons should be pleasure palaces, or places of leisure, but we should treat the people within them in a humane fashion.

I think treating them humanely involves programs that give prisoners the skills to make something of their life and help them to get their life back on track after their release, not TV. They should be kept active, healthy and entertained without whiling away their time unproductively in front of a television. As for the rest of the facilities, of course I agree that they should be humane. They should be clean and adequate to meet the requirements of prisoners, but nothing more than is absolutely necessary.

[Slow Love™]

Originally Posted by Mr Casson

I think treating them humanely involves programs that give prisoners the skills to make something of their life and help them to get their life back on track after their release, not TV. They should be kept active, healthy and entertained without whiling away their time unproductively in front of a television. As for the rest of the facilities, of course I agree that they should be humane. They should be clean and adequate to meet the requirements of prisoners, but nothing more than is absolutely necessary.

Not too much to disagree with there. If we're only going to disagree on TVs in cells, I can live with that. The main point I was making was that I don't think that vengeance on the inmates (by a society) should be the main priority of incarceration.

BTW, I wasn't suggesting that they would watch TV all day in their cells - prison life is quite regimented, and losing control over your own time is part of loss of liberty. I just don't have a problem with them having access to TV.

[Mr Casson]

Originally Posted by Slow Love™

Not too much to disagree with there. If we're only going to disagree on TVs in cells, I can live with that. The main point I was making was that I don't think that vengeance on the inmates (by a society) should be the main priority of incarceration.

BTW, I wasn't suggesting that they would watch TV all day in their cells - prison life is quite regimented, and losing control over your own time is part of loss of liberty. I just don't have a problem with them having access to TV.

Neither do I, really, you make very good points. Although I think that the variety of criminals are catered for in the different style of prisons (low security, high security etc.,) and low security prisons for example tend to allow the prisoners a lot more freedom within the confines of the prison, don't they? Either way, I think the dangerous criminals are mostly separated from those you mentioned who simply don't pay fines or go on joyrides.

[Slow Love™]

Well, it varies - there are still wide ranges of people categorized as "dangerous criminals". And people who are habitually violent versus somebody who struck out once, or was reckless, etc. And then there's the racial inequities (how many aborigines end up in these "low security" prison farms?) and those from poverty, drug users, etc, etc.

Pauline Hanson, jailed for electoral fraud was incarcerated with convicted murderers (they just happened to like her. ).

And that's without mentioning remand, where you're waiting in custody for sentencing (usually because you couldn't make bail), and where you can commonly grouped in with extremely violent people.

[Buddhmaster]

Prisons are for people to be punished for their actions. Sure they can be rehabilitated whilst there in there, but that's not the reason that they're going there.

[Neil Pickup]

The whole point of the judicial system is to reduce crime and as a function of that to reduce re-offending. Therefore prison should be a means to reduce the likelihood of reoffending.

[Mr Casson]

Originally Posted by Buddhmaster

Prisons are for people to be punished for their actions. Sure they can be rehabilitated whilst there in there, but that's not the reason that they're going there.

Why, hello Draco!

[KennyD]

Beaten twice a day should be a requirement in rehabilitaion

for horrible criminals of course, like murderers, rapists...Pauline