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Thread: World Politics Thread

  1. #61
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Warrior View Post
    There are.



    The short term consequence of Russia getting involved will be that Assad's regime will get a new lease of life. But without Russian collaboration and boots on the ground(someone has to do it), you are not defeating iSIS.

    So yes you will be left with Assad, but the world has always made these decisions. We opted for monsters like Stalin, Churchill and Truman over Hitler and Mussolini.
    US has failed miserably with their plans of handing out guns and ammunitions to rebels who in turn joined ISIS. Looking at Iraq now, the same thing happened and Iraq is not a better place now. Same would have happened with Syria if Russia did not intervene. Russia might have their own agendas but their intervention is what requires. Is Assad a bad dictator? Yes he is but toppling Assad and giving powers to the rebels fighting Assad is not going to bring peaceful life. The NATO puppets can make number of conferences to warn Russia; does not matter to Putin at all. On top of all the criticisms and warnings, just two days ago Putin met Assad. USA is providing more ammunitions to the hand of rebels and this has turned into some sort of proxy war now. Russia is pretty clear on its methods. They are destroying everything in Syria that is not Assad. So I agree with you above.
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  2. #62
    Cricketer Of The Year ankitj's Avatar
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    And the American predicament in Middle East - damned if they do something, damned in they don't.
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  3. #63
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ankitj View Post
    And the American predicament in Middle East - damned if they do something, damned in they don't.
    I fully admit that what US and NATO did or still doing that is launching assaults on ISIS held territories is necessary. But their plan of stacking up the rebels they believe in and launching an anti Assad campaign is not either here nor there. China has hundreds of troops ready to be deployed when Assad requires; also Russia and Iran. Russia has gone a bit further and started bombing rebel held areas along with ISIS held areas to back the advances of rebels upon Assad. Mind Assad is also battling ISIS.

  4. #64
    The Tiger King smalishah84's Avatar
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    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

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  5. #65
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyZaltzHair View Post
    I fully admit that what US and NATO did or still doing that is launching assaults on ISIS held territories is necessary. But their plan of stacking up the rebels they believe in and launching an anti Assad campaign is not either here nor there. China has hundreds of troops ready to be deployed when Assad requires; also Russia and Iran. Russia has gone a bit further and started bombing rebel held areas along with ISIS held areas to back the advances of rebels upon Assad. Mind Assad is also battling ISIS.
    This is patent nonsense.
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  6. #66
    Cricketer Of The Year watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Interesting article which seems to indicate that the conflict is fueled by the Sunni V Shia divide, and orchestrated by the two regional heavy-weights Saudi Arabia and Iran.

    Predictably, the US has fallen on the side of the Sunni cause because of it's oil cocerns, and Russia has backed the Shia cause so as to counteract the US.

    Which all goes to show that nothing has changed much since the 1950s. Sadly pathetic.
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  7. #67
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spark View Post
    This is patent nonsense.
    Reports in the medias are not authentic always but things do indicate that way.

    After the Russians and Iranians, Chinese troops reportedly are teaming up with the Syrian regime forces in what is being termed as the deal that will allow President Bashar al-Assad to stay in power.

    A report claims that a Chinese naval vessel carrying dozens of "military advisers" is on its way to Syria and the Chinese troops will then join with the "hundreds" of Russian soldiers.

    The Chinese troops are expected to join the Russian forces in the Latakia region, where the Russians are building a massive military base.

    Similarly Iran, emboldened by the Russians, last week dispatched 1,000 soldiers to Syria. Iran has claimed that it has deployed the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) to assist the Hezbollah in Zabadani.

    Chinese troops to join Russian marines in Syria soon, says report
    My point is China is fully allied with Russia, Assad and Iran

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyZaltzHair View Post
    US has failed miserably with their plans of handing out guns and ammunitions to rebels who in turn joined ISIS.
    See, the spin I hear most is that this is exactly what didn't happen. The most common story is that a lot of rebels joined ISIS because they were much better funded. Gulf-based benefactors were willing to buy them weapons, whereas the US and Western Europe wouldn't fund the secular rebels for fear of the arms falling into jihadist hands.

    Anyone who knows something about the area want to clear this up?

  9. #69
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyZaltzHair View Post
    Reports in the medias are not authentic always but things do indicate that way.



    My point is China is fully allied with Russia, Assad and Iran
    If you genuinely think that China is going to get itself seriously involved in a military conflict in Syria then you really don't know very much about China, and calling them a Russian ally is historically questionable at best. They're non-interventionist to the point of irrationality at times, and their newfound liking of R2P/military expansionism only extends as far as those bits of the world that it secretly regards as part of China proper anyway.

    Re: the US arming program. It's been going just fine, it's just been using Saudi/Qatar as proxy so the CIA involvement is less patently obvious. What has not been going so fine -- and has now been abandoned -- is their train-and-equip program, i.e. take rebels and somehow convince them to stop being rebels so they can fight ISIS instead, who everyone in Syria except the Kurds regards as very much a lower order threat compared to Assad.
    Last edited by Spark; 22-10-2015 at 08:51 AM.

  10. #70
    The Tiger King smalishah84's Avatar
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    yep, there is no way the chinese are involving themselves in any conflict in the middle east.

    Heck, they don't even get involved in Afghanistan which borders it.

  11. #71
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    yep, there is no way the chinese are involving themselves in any conflict in the middle east.

    Heck, they don't even get involved in Afghanistan which borders it.
    Which surprises me, tbh, they're really worried about jihadist inflows from the Turkestan countries into Xinjiang and surely the Taliban (and potentially ISIS!) having a presence on the fringes of the area has got to be a concern.

  12. #72
    The Tiger King smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spark View Post
    Which surprises me, tbh, they're really worried about jihadist inflows from the Turkestan countries into Xinjiang and surely the Taliban (and potentially ISIS!) having a presence on the fringes of the area has got to be a concern.
    They were actually one of the driving forces behind Pakistan conducting an anti militancy operation in the Pakistani areas bordering China's Xinjiang.

    So while they haven't gotten involved directly they have been trying to minimize the spillovers as much as possible (wherever they can). They probably don't have any influence inside Afghanistan hence can't do much there short of direct intervention. But yeah, they definitely don't seem they like they want to be involved.

  13. #73
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    China has certain interests in Syria particularly and while it may be far fetched as Spark already mentioned to see China's direct involvement into the war but China has clearly stated its position and far more vocal this time around sorrounding the conflict. So while they may not be directly shouldering arms with Putin but for their own goals, they seem to have common interests with Putin and Iran that is to back Assad. Call it allying or not. Here are some of the reasons:

    a) China is one of the biggest importers from Syria
    b) It sees Syria as one of its important trade hubs
    c) China has its own agendas with Tibet and other things and not in favor of any foreign interventions thus supporting the legitimate government in Syria i.e. Assad according to them
    Last edited by AndyZaltzHair; 22-10-2015 at 10:27 AM.

  14. #74
    The Tiger King smalishah84's Avatar
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    btw China just awarded the Confucius Award to Robert Mugabe, itstl

  15. #75
    Cricketer Of The Year AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spark View Post

    Re: the US arming program. It's been going just fine, it's just been using Saudi/Qatar as proxy so the CIA involvement is less patently obvious. What has not been going so fine -- and has now been abandoned -- is their train-and-equip program, i.e. take rebels and somehow convince them to stop being rebels so they can fight ISIS instead, who everyone in Syria except the Kurds regards as very much a lower order threat compared to Assad.
    Honestly I don't know what to believe anymore and what strategy will work in Syria. US after failing in train-equip program, now seems to have formed a policy of providing ammunitions to the selected rebels (Kurds?) and to their defence although they are keeping it fairly secret about the whole plan but I am very skeptical that this will work.

    But the plan appears to do little to quell deep concern from some of America’s closest allies in the region, does not address how the U.S. will prevent rebel troops from turning their attention from fighting extremists to attacking the regime of Bashar Assad, and heightens the possibility of an inadvertent confrontation with Russian forces supporting the Syrian dictator.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Some articles that tell why and how train and equip program has failed:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kills-in-iraq/

    Arming Syrian rebels: Where the US went wrong - BBC News
    Last edited by AndyZaltzHair; 22-10-2015 at 11:47 AM.

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