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Thread: The American Politics thread

  1. #19741
    International Vice-Captain Redbacks's Avatar
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    So it turns out the last 3 US presidents have supported the idea of recognising Jerusalem as the capital before getting elected...
    Last edited by Redbacks; 07-12-2017 at 03:36 AM.

  2. #19742
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbacks View Post
    So it turns out the last 3 US presidents have supported the idea of recognising Jerusalem as the capital before getting elected...
    Yet another example of the "brilliant" bipartisan consensus on US foreign policy.
    do you think people will be allowed to make violins?
    who's going to make the violins?

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  3. #19743
    International Captain StephenZA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbacks View Post
    So it turns out the last 3 US presidents have all promised to move the embassy to Jerusalem before getting elected...
    Clinton. Bush Jr did... and Obama mentioned Jerusalem as Israel's Capital but immediately backtracked, but no campaign promise...

    This has been on the cards from an American political point of view for awhile, with a law even enacted to move the embassy but each president realised the pragmatic and realistic world turmoil it would create and kept delaying. Yep, Trump will follow through with the campaign promise (that most Americans are probably not even aware of) and potentially destabilize the middle east... well done that man.
    "Here are the opinions on which my facts are based." - Humanity
    "Man occasionally stumbles on the truth, but then just picks himself up and hurries on regardless." - Anonymous

  4. #19744
    Cricketer Of The Year Gnske's Avatar
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    I'm just glad Jerusalem is finally getting the recognition it has long deserved
    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    When I was 14 a friend mentioned to me that using lube was a great way to enhance masturbation. Later that night I snuck into the bathroom, and grabbed a container of what I thought was moisturiser. It turned out to be tanning lotion, rendering both my hands and my **** orange for the next week or so.

    This video reminds me of that experience.


  5. #19745
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephenZA View Post
    Clinton. Bush Jr did... and Obama mentioned Jerusalem as Israel's Capital but immediately backtracked, but no campaign promise...

    This has been on the cards from an American political point of view for awhile, with a law even enacted to move the embassy but each president realised the pragmatic and realistic world turmoil it would create and kept delaying. Yep, Trump will follow through with the campaign promise (that most Americans are probably not even aware of) and potentially destabilize the middle east... well done that man.
    I mean I think it won't do as much as people think, because (1) everyone already assumed Israel had America's total backing anyway and (2) the two-state process was as dead as dead can be without actually being dead. Long-term this will probably result in a few more airplanes being blown up and people run over by trucks, so well done on that.

  6. #19746
    International Coach Ikki's Avatar
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    America is Isreal's ally, regardless of party and has been for a long time now. It should be no surprise that they'll stand with their ally over a non-ally so the indignation towards Trump makes little sense.
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  7. #19747
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Spikey's Avatar
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    I thought the long standing policy was to say Jerusalem is the capital but make absolutely no attempt to move any diplomatic stuff etc over there
    http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blo...cricket-legacy

    Brad McNamara ‏@bbuzzmc
    Will say this once and then nothing else. Defamation laws quite clear in Aus.be careful.

  8. #19748
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ikki View Post
    America is Isreal's ally, regardless of party and has been for a long time now. It should be no surprise that they'll stand with their ally over a non-ally so the indignation towards Trump makes little sense.
    As usual, Larison puts it best: Trump?s Ridiculous Announcement on Jerusalem | The American Conservative

    Trump describes what he did as proof of his “fresh thinking,” but there is nothing more stale and tired than having our government fully taking the Israeli side in this conflict. He can insist all he likes that the decision “is not intended in any way to reflect a departure from our strong commitment to facilitate a lasting peace agreement,” but the action proves that there is no such commitment. It will be interpreted as proof of our government’s bias and bad faith, and it is ridiculous to expect other nations to interpret it any other way.

    The best that can be said about Trump’s remarks is that he has to be delusional if he thinks that today’s announcement is compatible with making progress in securing a negotiated settlement. Any goodwill the Trump administration might have enjoyed with the Palestinians has been squandered for no reason, and Trump has now made it politically impossible for any Palestinian leader to be seen cooperating with the U.S.

  9. #19749
    International Captain StephenZA's Avatar
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    theconversation_what-trumps-recognition-of-jerusalem-as-the-capital-of-israel-means-for-the-middle-east

    Trump’s decision to move the embassy means he will not follow his predecessors by renewing a waiver on the Jerusalem Embassy Act of 1995, which required the embassy to eventually be moved from Tel Aviv.

    Since then, there has been a cross-party consensus in the US that any act which recognises the annexation of East Jerusalem by Israel and its designation as the country’s capital would affect the fragile balance of power in the Middle East – and the ability of the US to promote its interests in the region. US diplomats have sought to tread carefully on this issue in one of the world’s most treacherous political landscapes.
    Trump’s decision seems oblivious to the fragility of coexistence in the city between its Israeli and Palestinian inhabitants. It also ignores the significance of Jerusalem in Palestinian national identity and national aspirations, and the devastating impact on the future of a moribund peace process.

    It has the potential of not only affecting the political ecology of a place where history is a matter of life and death, but could also cause a ripple effect much further afield. It can destabilise a Palestinian authority already deprived of legitimacy and an array of fragile Arab regimes. And it is likely to accentuate the enmity between Israel and Iran. Iran perceives such a move as a “violation of Islamic sanctities” and, together with Trump’s revitalised alliance with Saudi Arabia, a clear sign of the US president’s anti-Iranian stance.

    Last but not least, it could further stoke the flames of anti-Western Islamic movements in the Muslim world and the West alike, which have always put Jerusalem and the Palestinian issue in a central position.
    "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread."

  10. #19750
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    based on scalys logic Scotland and Wales can divide England up between them since it was Celtic before Denmark and Willy visited.
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  11. #19751
    International Vice-Captain Redbacks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephenZA View Post
    Clinton. Bush Jr did... and Obama mentioned Jerusalem as Israel's Capital but immediately backtracked, but no campaign promise...

    This has been on the cards from an American political point of view for awhile, with a law even enacted to move the embassy but each president realised the pragmatic and realistic world turmoil it would create and kept delaying. Yep, Trump will follow through with the campaign promise (that most Americans are probably not even aware of) and potentially destabilize the middle east... well done that man.
    True, I corrected the post after you quoted it.

  12. #19752
    International Vice-Captain Redbacks's Avatar
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    My honest unabashed opinion:

    1 group believes fairy tale a ties them to a site, another group believes fairy tale b ties them to a site.

    We are too weak as a planet to call out this BS, so the problem wont ever be solved.

    What Trump does is merely poor decision making on what is already folly, with real world implications.

  13. #19753
    International Captain StephenZA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbacks View Post
    My honest unabashed opinion:

    1 group believes fairy tale a ties them to a site, another group believes fairy tale b ties them to a site.

    We are too weak as a planet to call out this BS, so the problem wont ever be solved.

    What Trump does is merely poor decision making on what is already folly, with real world implications.
    See Socialism and Ethics thread for further fairytales people like to tell themselves...

  14. #19754
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    Now that a precedence has been set for annexed land to be recognised, can Trump officially recognise Azad Kashmir as part of Pakistan and tell the Indians to stop contesting it.
    Last edited by Agent Nationaux; 07-12-2017 at 08:48 AM.

  15. #19755
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    Interesting historical rewrite, as expected though. Muslims have shown repeatedly that they're incapable of living peacefully with anyone, let alone other Muslims. Got their arses kicked when they waged war. Eventually gave up on that and have since instead resorted to terrorism and the persecution complex PR campaign aimed at soft touches/bleeding hearts. Wuckfits like Corbyn even called himself a friend of their terrorist groups.

    The best place in the Middle East to be a Muslim is in Israel, by a distance. Definitely would not recommend being a Jew in a Muslim country mind.

    Israel has every right to their part of Jerusalem, and to call it their capital. It's like a couple having a child, one is highly accomplished, intelligent and responsible, the other is Ian Brady - normally custody would be shared, but not one is so destructive.
    And now for a dose of reality.....

    My Jewish wife lived in the UAE for 8 years, loved it and was not discriminated against in any way, shape or form.

    Meanwhile, Ethiopian Jews are discriminated against in Israel with Tahounia Rubel describing it as the most racist country on earth



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