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Thread: The British Politics Thread

  1. #7576
    Spanish_Vicente sledger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uppercut View Post
    Unless I'm missing something, there's no argument here. Furball is saying "The jury fulfils role X better under Y circumstances". You're just repeating "The role of the jury is X".
    Not really, I am saying that in my view the role of the court should be X and X alone. Furball appears to be suggesting it should be something else.

  2. #7577
    Spanish_Vicente sledger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Furball View Post
    Rape and sexual assault cases are a perfect example of where the third verdict is useful. People too often confuse 'not guilty' with 'innocent.'
    Legally speaking not guilty and innocent are one and the same. Like I keep saying, the question to be answered is always "is there any criminal liability"? You are either acquitted or you are not.

    People might confuse common understandings of "not guilty" and "innocent", but that is not anything to do with the law, and so in my view the court should have no jurisdiction to make determinations in respect of such things.

  3. #7578
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sledger View Post
    Not really, I am saying that in my view the role of the court should be X and X alone. Furball appears to be suggesting it should be something else.
    I think he's actually suggesting that it might do a better job of X if you tell it to do Y instead.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJediBrah View Post
    Next week I'll probably be arguing the opposite

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  4. #7579
    Spanish_Vicente sledger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    I think he's actually suggesting that it might do a better job of X if you tell it to do Y instead.
    Right, ok, I see this point. My issue with it is that to me that a dichotomous guilty/not guilty judgment is qualitatively different from one that is of the guilty/not guilty/not proven type.


  5. #7580
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    Bear in mind there's a different standard of proof required in Scots Law.

    Technically, a confession from the accused is not enough evidence for a guilty verdict unless that evidence is corroborated.

    Going back to the Ched Evans case; if the bold Chedwyn had had an attack of conscience afterwards and gone to a police station to confess to raping his victim, in the absence of any other corroborating evidence to place him at the scene (such as hotel CCTV footage), a jury would have had to return a not proven verdict.

  6. #7581
    Spanish_Vicente sledger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Furball View Post
    Bear in mind there's a different standard of proof required in Scots Law.

    Technically, a confession from the accused is not enough evidence for a guilty verdict unless that evidence is corroborated.

    Going back to the Ched Evans case; if the bold Chedwyn had had an attack of conscience afterwards and gone to a police station to confess to raping his victim, in the absence of any other corroborating evidence to place him at the scene (such as hotel CCTV footage), a jury would have had to return a not proven verdict.
    Yeah, I appreciate the burden of proof is different, but whilst that explains the three verdict approach, it does not, in my mind at least, really justify it.

  7. #7582
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  8. #7583
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    Quite ****ing right.

    Scum companies like Uber shouldn't be allowed to disrupt the market by ignoring fundamental employment rights.

  9. #7584
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    I get why Uber operate the way they do but in some UK cities (certainly Glasgow) Uber drivers need to be licensed the same way as any other taxi driver. I can't just jump in my car and decide to taxi people around for a couple of hours a night.

  10. #7585
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    Where I am from, there actually used to be a TukTuk mafia run by people with connections to the government officials. Those ****ers charged like three hundred rupees for a certain distance totally depending on their whims and fancies. Uber pretty much made them obsolete by offering rides of the same distance for for 1/4th of the cost. So, everyone in my place loves Uber and I never thought too much about how the drivers earned their living and found the article interesting.

    Have they had a similar effect in cab rates the world over as well?

  11. #7586
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    There's a certain grim irony in the latest group of people exploiting their heritage to retain EU citizenship - descendants of Jews who fled Nazi persecution are now exercising their right to German citizenship.

  12. #7587
    Not sure what's the best thread for this. But anyway:

    Louis Smith: British Gymnastics bans four-time Olympic medallist over video - BBC Sport

    What an absolute ****ing disgrace. A completely innocuous, light-hearted, *private* video where he does nothing wrong other than pick a religion which has special privilege (well most of them do to be fair, but particularly Islam). I find it absolutely disgusting that this is happening in the country I live in. If you're not familiar with the video in question it is easy enough to Google, unfortunately it originates from The Scum.
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  13. #7588
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    He's been banned for being a constant ****wit and bringing the sport into disrepute.

  14. #7589
    Quote Originally Posted by Furball View Post
    He's been banned for being a constant ****wit and bringing the sport into disrepute.
    Nope he's been banned because he had private, meaningless banter about Islam.

  15. #7590
    Spanish_Vicente sledger's Avatar
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    Haha yeah, there's no way "banter" can possibly bring anything into disrepute. Just ask Sam Allardyce.



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