England thread

[Richard]

Originally Posted by Goughy

Naming a 15 man squad is tough. There are would probably be changes if I did it tomorrow.

First thing that stands out is that there is a lack of options, talent and depth.

Thought Process

I could only keep 2 of Bopara, Bell and Shah. Shah misses out based on Bells better record and Boparas big 200+ this season, though to be frank it could have been any of them.

Prior probably lucky to be included. Has a terrible record (average) at domestic level but he is stil the most capable of playing an innings (decent number of centuries). Id bat him down the order

Dimitri Mascarenhas misses out as I dont think his batting is strong enough to carry his bowling. He is certainly economical but as a specialist bowler you have to carry your share of the responsibility and he doesnt.

Luke Wright is lucky as hell. Its hard to justify his inclusion apart from the fact the only other options would be a slow scoring journeyman and we have plenty of them. He is included mainly due to lack of other options.

Jones and Plunkett excluded due to their poor record and they can let the game get away from them.

Strauss and Cook can be considered lucky and both a result of lack of quality options. Ive never believed Strauss was as terrible as some have made out. Also, Im a believer that if there is little, to nothing, to choose between 2 players then go with keeping the same players for all teams for continuity. I hate the idea of a mess of average players with caps all over. I dont think its any coincidence that the last time England were decent in ODIs that there were a number of 'specialist Test players' in the team.

Joyce included as he has a good career record and was never given a fair opportunity last time round

My 15
Ian Bell
Ravi Bopara
Paul Collingwood
Alastair Cook
Ed Joyce
Kevin Pietersen
Andrew Strauss
Matt Prior
Andrew Flintoff
Luke Wright.
James Anderson
Stuart Broad
Ryan Sidebottom
Graeme Swann
Chris Tremlett

Starting XI
Strauss
Bell
Joyce
Pietersen
Flintoff
Collingwood
Prior
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Sidebottom

A possible change being Bopara for Joyce

Frankly, I like it as much as I can given the players available.

As far as Im concerned there are only 4 automatic selections. Anderson, KP, Swann and and Flintoff

Broad is pretty automatic TBH. His recent ODI form has been a mixture of good, abysmal and outstanding, with less of the abysmal than anything else. Collingwood, being the captain, is also obviously an automatic selection, whoever likes it or not.

Regarding Strauss, I think he has more to lose by playing ODIs than England have to gain by him doing so. I cannot see that attempting to adjust his game to be better at OD batting (which he's never been good at, all career) did not impact on the problems he had at Test level in 2006 and 2007. Strauss is a good Test batsman when he's playing in a measured way. This can be messed-up by him playing ODIs.

I really would prefer Luke Wright open for the next 2 years than him. No player should ever damage their prospects as a Test cricketer by attempting to (successfully or unsuccessfully) improve as a ODI cricketer.

[Spinksy]

Can't be f***ed to do this to be honest. I like the look of the first XI named however.

[Samuel_Vimes]

Originally Posted by Richard

Ambrose who played a whole 2 games, scoring 28 and 1.

Hardly conclusive in any respect, 2 games.

New Zealand games not counting due to substandard opposition?

[Flem274*]

Cook
Bell
KP
Joyce
Collingwood
Flintoff
Read (once again, **** the ICL)
Broad
Swann
Sidebottom
Anderson

Mascarenhas
Tremlett
Shah
Bopara

Hope they do well, England are my second favourite ODI team for some reason, possibly sympathy and because they're fun: you never know what they'll do.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by Samuel_Vimes

New Zealand games not counting due to substandard opposition?

No, due to over-standard opposition.

ODIs =| domestic-OD cricket.

Had Mustard played them he might well have struggled to get into double-figures.

[tooextracool]

Originally Posted by Richard

No, due to over-standard opposition.

ODIs =| domestic-OD cricket.

Had Mustard played them he might well have struggled to get into double-figures.

Its interesting that Ambrose has only had 1 good domestic OD season and so has Mustard in their respective List A careers and yet you have jumped on the Ambrose bandwagon. I know you like Tim Ambrose, but he does not have any more of a case for selection than Mustard.

[tooextracool]

Originally Posted by TT Boy

Champions Trophy Preliminary Squad

Tim Ambrose, James Anderson, Ian Bell, Ravi Bopara, Tim Bresnan, Stuart Broad, Michael Carberry, Paul Collingwood, Alastair Cook, Andrew Flintoff, Simon Jones, Ed Joyce, Robert Key, Sajid Mahmood, Dimitri Mascarenhas, Phil Mustard, Graham Onions, Monty Panesar, Samit Patel, Darren Pattinson, Kevin Pietersen, Liam Plunkett, Matt Prior, Owais Shah, Ryan Sidebottom, Andrew Strauss, Graeme Swann, James Tredwell, Chris Tremlett, Luke Wright.

Your final 15?

My squad would be:

Tim Ambrose
Ian Bell
Ravi Bopara
Stuart Broad
Paul Collingwood
Alastair Cook
Andrew Flintoff
Simon Jones
Dimitri Mascarenhas
Samit Patel/Ian Trott
Kevin Pietersen
Owais Shah
Ryan Sidebottom
Graeme Swann
Luke Wright

[Richard]

Originally Posted by tooextracool

Its interesting that Ambrose has only had 1 good domestic OD season and so has Mustard in their respective List A careers and yet you have jumped on the Ambrose bandwagon. I know you like Tim Ambrose, but he does not have any more of a case for selection than Mustard.

Not really, no - apart from the fact he's the incumbant.

I simply think Ambrose is fairly obviously a far more skilled batsman than Mustard. Their records are indeed very similar. I'm not as confident about his ODI prowess as I am about his Test prowess, but if he can keep Mustard out of the team, it's all well and good. I simply do not rate Mustard, or Prior, or Geraint Jones, at all. As OD batsmen.