Asif, Aktar in Doping Charges

[TT Boy]

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

I am surprised international sportsmen would recourse to Nandrolone tho, which (from what I've read having zero chemical knowledge of my own) is a fairly primitive steroid compared to what is available for the unscrupulous.

It may be ‘primitive’ but it is highly effective (especially for guys with bone disease) and pretty easier to cover up. I myself have high levels of nandrolone through use of creatine and protein shakes whereas my brother produces high levels of it naturally, like Christophe Dugarry.

[Legglancer]

Originally Posted by Sanz

With all due respect to your rant, Didn't CA set a precedent in last world cup by suspending Shane Warne for one full year ?

Should have been for two years ....

[Xuhaib]

Originally Posted by TT Boy

PCB could have covered this up pretty easily, just make out both players broke down with injuries let them miss the Champions Trophy get the substance out of one’s system or don’t because testing will not occur in the forthcoming test series with the West Indies. Welcome them back and goodnight Charlie the West Indies.

PCB should be commended.

Thank god they did not do that.

[Beleg]

Hmm.

I am waiting for the player's side of the story.

In any case, I agree with Sanz.

[open365]

Did someone say that this was the first time the PCB had conducted drug tests or something?

If so, then that's even worse than i thought it was.

[haroon510]

it is just a sad day for me and i know for all the fans of cricket. i am a big fan of shoiab and asif it was just a dream pair shoaib and asif both opening the bowling.

i just think about the other options that pakistan have for world cup to open thier bowling. that is for sure that they are going to be ban for one to two years but what other options pakistan have for world cup. there is one thing for sure that if another bowler comes in and perform the same way as shoiab and asif performs that will ease the pain for pakistani fans.

[Turbinator]

haroon510 please change your avatar!! No no, I am just kidding, yea what can I say I was quite shocked and TBH (I'll be honest, unlike many of you Indian fans here) I was kind of delighted at the same time. I was sad because Asif is a great young cricketer with tremendous potential and has to go through this and Akhtar is also obviously a great bowler. Also, Asif doesn't look very educated to be able to deal with all this. But, however, I am kind of delighted too because if they get banned, as Indian fans and players, we won't have to worry about losing to are arch rivals anytime soon. However, if they are guilty then they don't deserve our pity. But if they are innocent, then I really do feel sad for them.

Good luck to all you Pakistanis, hope things get better soon. (I am NOT being sarcastic)

[andyc]

To all those comparing this with Warne, keep in mind that the drug he tested positive for was only a diuretic, which at worst is a masking agent, whereas nandrolone is a full on performance enhancing steroid.

[Matt79]

Well done to the PCB for acting so resolutely with this so far - I hope, and am sure, they will follow through now.

I'm extremely dubious as to whether we'll see any "logical" explanation coming out - just the same crap all drug cheats pull out when they're busted - tall tales that are amusing in their creativity and apparent ignorance of science but which are just rubbish. Drug cheats are the worst cancer in sport and these guys should get at least 1 or 2 years ban and be on probation for the rest of their careers after that. The international norm which should be applied here is a 1 or 2 year ban for a first offence and a lifetime ban for a second and that seems fair to me. Asif is young enough to come back from that if he stays clean.

What's an extra frightening and sad aspect of this is that they've failed what are apparently the first tests they've ever had to take. The charitable assumption, which has been mentioned several times so far in the thread, is that they started taking the junk recently to overcome long term injuries, but the fact is that we don't KNOW that to be true - its possible they've been on the stuff for some period of time. This is particularly devastating for Shoaib as it throws doubt over the legitimacy of all his performances to date and makes his title of World's Fastest Bowler rather hollow. I'm suret they'll deny this is the case, but neither guy has much credibility in my eyes at the moment.

I don't think any blame can be legitimately allocated to the increased number of games/pressure to get over injuries faster. That ** doesn't wash in full blown contact sports like rugby and AFL where guys play week in week out, so I don't care how much cricket is played, its not an excuse for cricketers.

Finally, have to say that it was probably inevitable that a scandal like this was going to happen in cricket - and already had with Warne's case - which admittedly wasn't a steroid, but still fully meritted a year out and a missed World Cup. Also, if it was going to happen, its unsurprising it is a couple of fast bowlers - they're really the only category of player who would benefit, apart from injury recovery, from the increased strength the drugs give you.

Again, feel awful for the Pakistani fans and for the rest of the team. Surely a real slap in the face for the people like Inzi who had prided themselves on introducing a policy of morality as part of the team culture. Here's hoping some other guys can come good and relegate these cheats to the nothing they deserve.

[Scaly piscine]

Originally Posted by andyc

To all those comparing this with Warne, keep in mind that the drug he tested positive for was only a diuretic, which at worst is a masking agent, whereas nandrolone is a full on performance enhancing steroid.

A diuretic can be used to aid weight loss, so it can be construed as performance enhancing. The fact that could be used as a masking agent as well means on those two counts alone it should be treated as the same magnitude of ban as someone on nandrolone. When someone is caught with an illegal substance in their system you automatically consider it as the worst case scenario with that substance because it's usually impossible to deduce whether it was just an accident or they're a long-time cheat or what.

[BoyBrumby]

WRT Warne I personally think the circumstantial evidence is pretty damning. The chain of events goes something like:

-Warne dislocates shoulder before World Cup that he has already said will be his swansong in ODIs & puts his participation in real doubt
-?
-Warne makes quicker than expected recovery from dislocated shoulder & is able to take part in World Cup
-Warne ingests diuretic
-Warne pinged for said diuretic

Now the "?" may or may not have involved taking something like an anabolic steroid that is known to speed recovery, but frankly I find it rather more plausible than the whole "wanting to look slim on telly" excuse. For mine potentially the only thing that separates Warne from Asif & Ahktar is the efficacy of his masking agent, which is why I'd advocate a similar ban.

[social]

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

WRT Warne I personally think the circumstantial evidence is pretty damning. The chain of events goes something like:

-Warne dislocates shoulder before World Cup that he has already said will be his swansong in ODIs & puts his participation in real doubt
-?
-Warne makes quicker than expected recovery from dislocated shoulder & is able to take part in World Cup
-Warne ingests diuretic
-Warne pinged for said diuretic

Now the "?" may or may not have involved taking something like an anabolic steroid that is known to speed recovery, but frankly I find it rather more plausible than the whole "wanting to look slim on telly" excuse. For mine potentially the only thing that separates Warne from Asif & Ahktar is the efficacy of his masking agent, which is why I'd advocate a similar ban.

Exactly right.

[open365]

Originally Posted by Scaly piscine

A diuretic can be used to aid weight loss, so it can be construed as performance enhancing. The fact that could be used as a masking agent as well means on those two counts alone it should be treated as the same magnitude of ban as someone on nandrolone. When someone is caught with an illegal substance in their system you automatically consider it as the worst case scenario with that substance because it's usually impossible to deduce whether it was just an accident or they're a long-time cheat or what.

Er..i'm pretty sure a diuretic isn't classed as a performance enhancing drug.

It's on the list because it mask other drugs he may have taken.

[maxpower]

What is the policy of ICC and illegal drug use ? this test seems to be done by PCB and even in Warne's case I think ACB did the test, in order to be more strict should'nt ICC be conducting these tests like other sports do ?

Also there has to be clearity on what is allowed as legal use, if using something like protein shakes can cause this, then its quite hard to control.

[Langeveldt]

Originally Posted by maxpower

What is the policy of ICC and illegal drug use ? this test seems to be done by PCB and even in Warne's case I think ACB did the test, in order to be more strict should'nt ICC be conducting these tests like other sports do ?

Also there has to be clearity on what is allowed as legal use, if using something like protein shakes can cause this, then its quite hard to control.

The last thing we need is handing over a complex process such as drugs testing to a bunch of non-entities such as the ICC