Who is Pakistan's greatest spin bowler?

[Migara]

We have seen many great fast bowlers from Pakistan, but the supply of great spinners are somewhat limited. Who do you think is Pakistan's greatest spin bolwer?

 

[TheJediBrah]

Really drops off a cliff after the first few heh

 

[Starfighter]

If the inclusion of Arshad wasn't for ****s and giggles I'll be bloody disappointed.

Also well done on omitting Ajmal.

 

[Starfighter]

Anyway, I went for Saqlain but they don't have anyone approaching the quality of a Murali or Warne even over a much shorter period. Only one averaging below 30, which is telling even though their pitches (and pitches for spinners in general since covering became common) are quite tough. I would not be comfortable declaring any of them definitely better than Swann.

 

[cnerd123]

Abbamania

Twelve years ago, Abdul Qadir, still good enough to turn out for Pakistan, spent a summer playing club cricket in Melbourne. The few who saw him remember it like it was yesterday

www.espncricinfo.com

 

[CricAddict]

Is Shakib a better spinner than all of the above, except Saqlain?

 

[trundler]

Saqlain is easily better than Swann. Swann is a great beneficiary of English test spam and DRS. Also retired mid way through a tough tour to arbitrarily keep his average under 30. Saqlain played through ****ed knees and has spells in India and even Australia that Swann never matched. Mushtaq is pretty underrated for his SENA contributions too. Not much after those two though. Qadir's reputation is somewhat puzzling, Qasim looks better in hindsight.

 

[Migara]

If the inclusion of Arshad wasn't for ****s and giggles I'll be bloody disappointed.

Also well done on omitting Ajmal.

Forgot him. Added

 

[trundler]

Ajmal should be excluded on principle but he's still a hero for wrecking England whilst shamelessly cheating. 5 WPM babeh.

 

[cnerd123]

Qadir's reputation is somewhat puzzling

Mate

 

[Lillian Thomson]

Abdul Qadir was great at the time because high quality leg spinners were a rarity. It was generally accepted pre-Warne that leg spinners could be a bit more expensive than off spinners. To look at stats guru and conclude he was no good is doing him a great disservice.

 

[a massive zebra]

Only one averaging below 30, which is telling even though their pitches (and pitches for spinners in general since covering became common) are quite tough.

Pervez Sajjad also averaged way under 30.

 

[a massive zebra]

Saqlain Mushtaq. One of the few foreign spinners to have success in India against the great batting lineup that hammered Warne time and again.

 

[a massive zebra]

Abdul Qadir was great at the time because high quality leg spinners were a rarity. It was generally accepted pre-Warne that leg spinners could be a bit more expensive than off spinners. To look at stats guru and conclude he was no good is doing him a great disservice.

It's all very well claiming statsguru lacks context and watching players at the time gives a better understanding of their skill set. But when a highly rated player has virtually no success throughout their entire career you have to call into question the credibility of that common consensus. Abdul Qadir's away record was not "a bit more expensive" but absolutely appalling (68 wickets @ 48, with an average of over 40 in every overseas country in which he played more than 3 Tests), and orders of magnitude worse than several other Pakistani spinners such as Saqlain Mushtaq.

 

[Starfighter]

The feting of Qadir despite his almost complete lack of success away from friendly umpiring and volatile partisan crowds (basically excepting his 7/96 against England) is a perfect example of my observation that style is often more convincing than substance in cricket.

Sure he had plenty of tricks, but a full toss or long hop once or twice an over will outweigh any of that when it comes to what's written in the scorebook. Ultimately he simply wasn't accurate enough to be a really top-class test bowler.

 

[Lillian Thomson]

I’m not saying that Abdul was Archbishop Ferdinand’s spare hat. He was entertaining to watch at the time and on his day a match winner or partnership breaker. He might not have had as many days as an Excel spreadsheet would like, but there is nothing to warrant being so dismissive of him.

 

[Starfighter]

QED

 

[TT Boy]

Abdur Rehman was better than some of the bowlers listed. Imran Tahir as well.

 

[jayjay]

Qadir is an all time great, Saqlain, Mushy and Saeed in there too. Sad how Ajmal is viewed by posters on here when a lot of that chucking issue was out of his control and just 5 or 6 years earlier he would have been cleared same as Akhtar or Murali.

 

[honestbharani]

If the inclusion of Arshad

The original uncle.. Deserves to be in the HoF for that. These pretend uncles should learn a thing or two from him.