Anil
Hall of Fame Member
It's not a rabbit hole, the IPL is an exhibition.
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The Golf Thread
- Thread starter V Reddy
- Start date
“Exhibition Tour” & “Blood Money” are 2 of the most laughably hypocritical criticisms of LIV
The RBC Heritage is an invitation only, no cut event - it’s literally LIV plus 18 holes and typical of elevated events
Are they exhibitions?
The PGAT’s naming rights sponsor is a massive investor in Saudi
The PGAT’s investors raise money from Saudi
The owner of DPWT’s (of which the PGAT is a shareholder) naming rights sponsor has been accused in a British court of kidnapping and domestic violence plus the country has a terrible human rights record
Jack Nicklaus earns millions per year in <wait for it> Saudi fkn Arabia
Blood money?
Can understand parochial Americans being PGAT fanboys but not international golf fans
The RBC Heritage is an invitation only, no cut event - it’s literally LIV plus 18 holes and typical of elevated events
Are they exhibitions?
The PGAT’s naming rights sponsor is a massive investor in Saudi
The PGAT’s investors raise money from Saudi
The owner of DPWT’s (of which the PGAT is a shareholder) naming rights sponsor has been accused in a British court of kidnapping and domestic violence plus the country has a terrible human rights record
Jack Nicklaus earns millions per year in <wait for it> Saudi fkn Arabia
Blood money?
Can understand parochial Americans being PGAT fanboys but not international golf fans
Molehill
International Captain
When Spieth burst onto the scene, people did wonder. But none of them have ever showed a level of form that Scheffler is at now, where he is so far ahead of his peers. He really is at Tiger levels, whether he can maintain it as long as Tiger did seems unlikely as he's already admitted that becoming a father will take priority over golf (we all know Tiger wasn't the best Family Man).
The US picked Koepka last year anyway, so you could say their team wouldn't be impacted. Europe losing Rahm especially and now Hatton would struggle more.
A PGA v LIV Tournament would be fun, although pretty one sided I suspect, especially given how poor the International side has always been in the President's Cup.
Molehill
International Captain
That's quite the myth. The last player to qualify for the PGA Tour from DPWT last year was Pavon - he's since won at Torrey and was a pretty handy 12th in his first Masters. These are seriously good golfers. The top 22 at the Masters featured at least 8 who had come through the European Tour.
It's hard to take you seriously with comments like this. Hilton Head is one of the world's most iconic courses, 35 of the Top 40 at the Masters will be there, it deserves its status as an elevated event.
At the next LIV event, 35 of the top 40 at the Masters will not be there. It will be played on some course no one has had heard of, over 54 holes with a shotgun start. It is literally nothing like the Heritage.
You need to stop thinking that the rest of the world views golf tournaments like the people in Adelaide. We are not starved of seeing the top guys - I live 40 mins from Wentworth for example. You can knock the DPWT all you like, but they get attendances at their events that LIV can only dream of. We are not all salivating at the thought of LIV coming to town. Only Adelaide has created any kind of atmosphere in the LIV world, not sure that reflects well on Aussies if truth be told.
You can knock the PGA and Nicklaus, but the human rights records are not comparable. And the PGA is not throwing out $500m just to get players to turn up to tournaments. The PGA was clearly by no means perfect, but **** me it's a whole lot better than LIV.
You obviously overlooked the word “average”
The British Masters with a purse of $9 million is not your average DPWT event
The vast majority of DPWT events have a purse of around $2 million and are the equivalent of a KFT event in an exotic location
Btw, the DPWT soon stages an event in that paragon of virtue China so spare me the faux outrage
As for Pavon, chances are that he will be a PGAT member next season due to the “alliance” so enjoy him while you can
The British Masters with a purse of $9 million is not your average DPWT event
The vast majority of DPWT events have a purse of around $2 million and are the equivalent of a KFT event in an exotic location
Btw, the DPWT soon stages an event in that paragon of virtue China so spare me the faux outrage
As for Pavon, chances are that he will be a PGAT member next season due to the “alliance” so enjoy him while you can
Molehill
International Captain
Pavon has already become a PGA Tour Member because of the alliance. I was merely pointing out that given how he has taken the PGA Tour by storm having barely scraped in as Top 10 in the DPWT last year, perhaps the quality of the DPWT is somewhat better than you think.
What both that and the KFT have in common is a lot of golfers trying to improve, battling for their livelihoods and careers. It results in competitive golf that means something. That simply doesn't happen on LIV. These guys are not battling for their lives, it really doesn't matter where they finish, they've been paid up already. It is this aspect more than any other which makes the average golf fan have zero interest in it.
Lol
The bottom 4 finishers in LIV are relegated and replaced by the Asian Tour OOM winner and the top 3 place getters at a qualifying tournament in Abu Dhabi
LIV Golf League Adds Three New Players From Qualifying Event - Sports Illustrated
A DP World Tour winner will be joining the Saudi-backed league as well as a second member of the Vincent family.
www.si.com
Before you say “but they get guaranteed income on LIV”, PGAT rookies receive $500,000 to help with expenses in their first year
One day you’ll realise that much of what you hear from PGAT sycophants is bs
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Molehill
International Captain
I guess the slight difference here is that the 4 who get 'relegated' have already been given huge sums of money, something their standard of golf simply doesn't deserve. I presume one of those will be Anthony Kim having served his purpose as a bizarre circus act.
Read above
Every rookie on the PGAT is given $500k
They’re different sides of the same coin
The PGAT’s only real problem with LIV is that it isn’t the PGAT
Molehill
International Captain
Er, you missed out a key point there. It's paid up front but is recouped from earnings. So it's more a loan.Read above
Every rookie on the PGAT is given $500k
They’re different sides of the same coin
The PGAT’s only real problem with LIV is that it isn’t the PGAT
Whereas in the article you linked, it says how the 3 qualifiers are guaranteed over $1.25m no matter what the quality of their golf. A reminder that you get sweet FA if you miss the cut on the PGA Tour (or any other one).
Clearly not - although given the dross that normally resides at the bottom of a LIV Leaderboard, it's never going to happen anyway.
Simple answer is “no” as has a guaranteed contract for 4-5 (plus he won a couple of tournaments ago so no danger of that anyway)
Lower profile guys are on shorter contracts
These are the current standings
LIV Golf 2024 Season Standings | LIV Golf
See the latest standings from the 2024 LIV Golf Season
AFAIK contract terms aren’t public but there’s talk that some older players like Westwood might be moved on
Think it’s year 3 so some of the original contracts are likely to be up for renewal sooner rather than later
Aidan11
International Vice-Captain
He has confirmed this is not true.
Molehill
International Captain
That table is interesting, it makes you realise why Westwood was so keen to join up - think he knew his game was all but gone and took the money, don't blame him.These are the current standings
LIV Golf 2024 Season Standings | LIV Golf
See the latest standings from the 2024 LIV Golf Seasonwww.livgolf.com
AFAIK contract terms aren’t public but there’s talk that some older players like Westwood might be moved on
Think it’s year 3 so some of the original contracts are likely to be up for renewal sooner rather than later
The name I find sad is Mito Pereira. He's gone from being the next big thing on the PGA Tour - nearly winning a Major - to languishing down at the bottom of this League. It seems like the Latin American golfers were easy targets for LIV, keen to get money back to their families. Niemann undoubtedly has the talent to win Majors, whether he now will remains to be seen. But despite winning regularly on LIV, he doesn't seem like a happy chap. In fact, it seems like the more you win, the more unhappy you are (as you realise what you could've been achieving if you'd hung around elsewhere).
No surprise to see the Rory rumours were rubbish. Who would believe a Business Paper with no record of reporting on golf? Rory paired with Aberg for the first 2 days at the Heritage (Scheffler with Spieth), that'll be worth watching.
Westwood is a bit of a mystery
I know that he’s getting on a bit but he was already rich and his money was unlikely to be life changing
Game has fallen off a cliff
Molehill
International Captain
Not life changing, but undoubtedly more than he was going to earn on the PGA. He's got other interests, owns a few racehorses now, spends a fair bit of time watching Nottingham Forest too. I just don't think he's overly bothered by golf anymore, took the money for one last hurrah and will head off. Can't see him being one to head to the Seniors Tour, think he's probably done with the game.
Don’t know enough about him tbh
There’s a couple of rankings groups that incorporate LIV and Champions Tours players in their list and they have him at about #700 which is a monumental drop off for a guy with his pedigree
The guy won the Race to Dubai 3 years ago
Molehill
International Captain
Not to mention the epic duel with DeChambeau at Bay Hill before challenging for the Players. You're right, he really dropped off fast and I'm pretty certain you can tie that in to his first fat pay cheque from LIV. Bubba another who is miles from where he was.