View Poll Results: Is relegation a good thing in sport?

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  • Yes

    18 85.71%
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Thread: Relegation: good thing or bad thing?

  1. #46
    Global Moderator vic_orthdox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    The Prem has had 4 different winners since it was invented. Not a lot, no, but not too bad when compared with some other top leagues.

    AFAIC, the fact that the same teams are usually up there is if anything a good thing, as it makes it more of an achievement when a team manages to break the monopoly (Blackburn in 1995, Newcastle very nearly in 1996).
    Haha, pick the guy who supports one of the big 4.

  2. #47
    Hall of Fame Member steds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
    The gap between the EPL and Division 1 is the annoying thing, so so wide that clubs struggle so much to stay up.
    Due to the amount of money floating about in the prem, imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    AFAIC, the fact that the same teams are usually up there is if anything a good thing, as it makes it more of an achievement when a team manages to break the monopoly (Blackburn in 1995, Newcastle very nearly in 1996).


    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    Hardly impossible though - Reading and Wigan have demonstrated that.
    Coincidence that they're both bankrolled by rather successful businessmen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel_Vimes View Post
    Spot the top-four supporter...
    Quote Originally Posted by vic_orthdox View Post
    Haha, pick the guy who supports one of the big 4.
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  3. #48
    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    The Prem has had 4 different winners since it was invented. Not a lot, no, but not too bad when compared with some other top leagues.

    AFAIC, the fact that the same teams are usually up there is if anything a good thing, as it makes it more of an achievement when a team manages to break the monopoly (Blackburn in 1995, Newcastle very nearly in 1996).
    You can't be serious Tom, let's get real here. Four is pretty bad IMO. I know its a different sport, but since 2000 alone the AFL has had 5 different winners, and that includes a team which won 3 in a row and was one of the most dominant ever.
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  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by steds View Post
    Coincidence that they're both bankrolled by rather successful businessmen?
    Probably not, but they've hardly spent money left right and centre, have they?

    Wigan also have the added disadvantage of having virtually no support.

    As for big 4, yes I support one of them, but that doesn't really influence my view. As I said, it makes it more of an achievement to break into it, and it's not like it's unachievable either. It's changed a fair amount since the Prem began, most notably Blackburn and Newcastle going from major challengers to being nowehere now.

    Besides, if you wanted to change it, franchising the Premiership is certainly not the solution - getting rid of the Champion's League and its prize-money is.
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  5. #50
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Matteh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    Probably not, but they've hardly spent money left right and centre, have they?

    Wigan also have the added disadvantage of having virtually no support.

    As for big 4, yes I support one of them, but that doesn't really influence my view. As I said, it makes it more of an achievement to break into it, and it's not like it's unachievable either. It's changed a fair amount since the Prem began, most notably Blackburn and Newcastle going from major challengers to being nowehere now.

    Besides, if you wanted to change it, franchising the Premiership is certainly not the solution - getting rid of the Champion's League and its prize-money is.
    Basically far too much money at top level football these days. The fact that someone can get paid £100,000 a week purely for playing one maybe two games a week is ridiculous.
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  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
    Basically far too much money at top level football these days. The fact that someone can get paid £100,000 a week purely for playing one maybe two games a week is ridiculous.
    Supply and demand.

  7. #52
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Matteh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    Hardly impossible though - Reading and Wigan have demonstrated that.
    I remember when Bolton, Sunderland, Middlesborough, Crystal Palace spent many a season yo-yoing between the divisions.

    Still applies to the likes of WBA today and then there's the jokers who somehow get in the Prem like Barnsley and Bradford. What was shocking about Bradford was that they somehow stayed up.

  8. #53
    Hall of Fame Member chaminda_00's Avatar
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    In defense to Tom the EPL is alot better then say the French league where Lyon has won it seven times in a row. I think that was his point, but compare that to the NRL and AFL where salary caps have meant realistically you could have a different winner every season. I know what system i think works better.
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  9. #54
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
    Basically far too much money at top level football these days. The fact that someone can get paid £100,000 a week purely for playing one maybe two games a week is ridiculous.
    Yet nobody complains when the top actors get $10m-20m a film.
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  10. #55
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Matteh's Avatar
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    The amount of money in F1 is ridiculous too. Ferrari spend 300mil in a season, Champ Car teams spend about 18mil.

    Schumacher was looking to get around 20-25 mil every year. Even someone like Button would get 8mil easily.

  11. #56
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    I don't see why people complain though. It's simple supply and demand. The reason they get payed so much is because so many people are so interested by it.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    What I don't understand is how can the EPL then be deemed the best and most exciting league in the world, when the title race from game 1 is for the most part down to 3-4 clubs? 5-6 if we want to be generous. Its ridiculous, and the one thing I hate about the EPL.

    I love how the AFL equalises teams, and every club must rebuild at one stage. Brisbane Lions put out one of the greatest teams of all time from 2001-2004 with four straight Grand Final appearances, three of those resulting in premierships. Yet in the last two years they have not made the finals, and many are predicting a bottom 3 finish for them this year.

    Similarly West Coast were at the bottom of the scrap heap 5-6 years ago, and have made clear progress since then. In 2003 and 2004 they managed to fight back and made finals, and in 2005 and 2006 they have made the Grand Final twice, winning last year's.

    Fair enough there are stories of continued mediocrity such as Richmond, Hawthorn etc., but it was only six years ago that both those clubs made the preliminary finals, and one of them was a kick away from a Grand Final.

    I don't understand how year in year out it can be exciting seeing most teams struggle for mid-table status, whilst your Man U, Arsenal, Liverpool etc. dominate the league.
    It's a fair point you make WRT The Prem, but it's an issue that cuts across countries in Association Football. For instance in Portugal Boavista's title in 2001 was the first time a team from outside of their big three (Sporting, Porto & Benfica) had taken the championship since 1946 (!), in Holland no-one outside their big three (Ajax, PSV & Feyenoord) has won the title since AZ 67 in 1981 & in Italy Roma in 2000 & Lazio in 2001 are the only times either Juve or Milan haven't finished top (as opposed to winning the title) since 1991.

    The lack of a salary cap means success breeds success or, for the more cynically minded, money breeds more money!

    It's really the style of football that's played (fast, end-to-end stuff) that causes our league to be dubbed the most exciting rather than the unpredictability of the outcome. One year (2001, IIRC) the newly promoted Ipswich Town finished fifth & their manager was awarded manager of the year! Few demured either; such is the difficulty of achieving that without massive financial backing it was deemed more praise-worthy than ManUre winning yet another title!

    Also, when comparing the AFL to the Prem, you have to remember AFL teams aren't likely to lose their players to Italy or Spain if they aren't paid top whack. The talent may be spread more evenly, but it would mainly just be thinned out if we introduced a cap.
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  13. #58
    Global Moderator vic_orthdox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    Supply and demand.
    Is it a true market when there are such large losses, though?

  14. #59
    International Vice-Captain Linda's Avatar
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    No one is close to convincing me that the EPL is in a fair and interesting competition. I just dont get it.
    Didnt realise (am pretty clueless when it comes to soccer) the French League had a club that won it 7 times in a row. What the hell is the point?!

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  15. #60
    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    No one is close to convincing me that the EPL is in a fair and interesting competition. I just dont get it.
    Didnt realise (am pretty clueless when it comes to soccer) the French League had a club that won it 7 times in a row. What the hell is the point?!
    TBF it's probably partly the sport that you aren't receptive to.

    The best argument for relegation is that it gives hope (however nominal) to supporters of teams outside the top flight that one day their club will be in with the big boys. I know nothing about AFL at all, but if you were a follower of (say) South Melbourne back in the day you're now either faced with a mother of a round trip to see "your" team or to start to follow one of the other local clubs, which is usually anethema to any fan. When Wimbledon relocated to Milton Keynes & were "rebranded" as the MK Dons over here a group of local supporters formed their own team called AFC Wimbledon who do have that chance (however minimal it is) that they could be back in the big time one day.

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