View Poll Results: Is relegation a good thing in sport?

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  • Yes

    18 85.71%
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    3 14.29%
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Thread: Relegation: good thing or bad thing?

  1. #31
    International Vice-Captain Linda's Avatar
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    Dont understand how a League can run fairly without a salary cap. How do bottom teams ever get off the bottom? Surely its more boring watching the same few teams win and lose than the same list of teams play every season?

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  2. #32
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Matteh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    Dont understand how a League can run fairly without a salary cap. How do bottom teams ever get off the bottom? Surely its more boring watching the same few teams win and lose than the same list of teams play every season?
    Comes in spurts (there's a Cameronism if ever i heard it). In the EPL Liverpool in the 80s, Arsenal at some point in the 90s but mostly Man Utd in the 90s, Chelsea in the 00s.

    Other teams like Bolton buy players who were amazing 5 years ago and sort of aren't anymore but somehow they do quite well.
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  3. #33
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    Dont understand how a League can run fairly without a salary cap. How do bottom teams ever get off the bottom? Surely its more boring watching the same few teams win and lose than the same list of teams play every season?
    The Prem is boring. The FL is where it's at

    Premiership should introduce a salary cap. As Brumby said, Chelsea would be effed
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  4. #34
    Hall of Fame Member Goughy's Avatar
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    With the Prem, Id be in favour of a soft salary cap.

    Meaning that a team could spend whatever it wishes but that there is a pound for pond penalty for going over the limit.

    Lets say the wage limit is 1 000 000 per week.

    Every 1 GBP a club went over that they would be taxed 1 GBP.

    This tax revenue would then be split at the end of the season between the teams below the limit.

    Lets say Chelsea spend 3 mil a week on wages (hypothetical figure) under this system the total cost would be 5 mil with 2 mil going into a kitty to be split between the lower spending clubs.

    Its a form of revenue sharing that clubs are not forced into and have a choice over whether to spend big and pay the tax or stay within the boundary.

    As we know, some Prem clubs spend far more than others. Thie system allows them to do so but also gives benefits to the disadvantaged clubs.

    There is a similar system in the NBA.

    A hard salary cap, like in the NFL, is not approprate for the Prem as it puts them at a massive disadvantage to other European clubs and they would lose a lot of players.
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  5. #35
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Samuel_Vimes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
    Comes in spurts (there's a Cameronism if ever i heard it). In the EPL Liverpool in the 80s, Arsenal at some point in the 90s but mostly Man Utd in the 90s, Chelsea in the 00s.
    That era is well and truly buried with the CL prize money being so outrageously huge.

    15 years from now we'll still see Arsenal, Man U, Chelsea, Liverpool fighting it out (bar Acts of Russian businessmen playing God or bankruptcy among one of the top four).
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  6. #36
    Hall of Fame Member Goughy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel_Vimes View Post

    15 years from now we'll still see Arsenal, Man U, Chelsea, Liverpool fighting it out (bar Acts of Russian businessmen playing God or bankruptcy among one of the top four).
    As a Liverpool fan it pains me to say it but in 15 yrs I doubt we will be in the mix.

    We are still an attractive club for players due to our history but as the glory years fade it will become increasingly difficult to bring top quality players in. Basically, top level European and South American players want to live in London. Its a sad fact but understandable.

    Liverpool will increasingly be reliant (as we have been for a long time) on locally developed talent and the youth system (Fowler, Owen, McManaman, Gerrard etc)

  7. #37
    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda View Post
    Dont understand how a League can run fairly without a salary cap. How do bottom teams ever get off the bottom? Surely its more boring watching the same few teams win and lose than the same list of teams play every season?
    The equalisation of the teams is probably the best argument for a franchise-based top flight. Put simply in our Premiership the big clubs are just too rich for the little guys to compete.

    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel_Vimes View Post
    That era is well and truly buried with the CL prize money being so outrageously huge.

    15 years from now we'll still see Arsenal, Man U, Chelsea, Liverpool fighting it out (bar Acts of Russian businessmen playing God or bankruptcy among one of the top four).
    Man speaks the truth. Prem top four this decade:

    99/00
    1 Man Utd
    2 Arsenal
    3 Leeds Utd
    4 Liverpool (Chelsea 5th)

    00/01
    1 Man Utd
    2 Arsenal
    3 Liverpool
    4 Leeds Utd (Chelsea 6th)

    01/02
    1 Arsenal
    2 Liverpool
    3 Man Utd
    4 Newcastle Utd (Chelsea 6th)

    02/03
    1 Man Utd
    2 Arsenal
    3 Newcastle Utd
    4 Chelsea (Liverpool 5th)

    03/04
    1 Arsenal
    2 Chelsea
    3 Man Utd
    4 Liverpool

    04/05
    1 Chelsea
    2 Arsenal
    3 Man Utd
    4 Everton (Liverpool 5th)

    05/06
    1 Chelsea
    2 Man Utd
    3 Liverpool
    4 Arsenal

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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
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  9. #39
    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goughy View Post
    Liverpool will increasingly be reliant (as we have been for a long time) on locally developed talent and the youth system (Fowler, Owen, McManaman, Gerrard etc)
    It's a comforting thought, but simply not true. In Liverpool's matchday fifteen v ManUre on Saturday they had two home-produced players (Carragher & Gerrard).

    & one of those was poached from another nearby club:
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  10. #40
    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    The equalisation of the teams is probably the best argument for a franchise-based top flight. Put simply in our Premiership the big clubs are just too rich for the little guys to compete.



    Man speaks the truth. Prem top four this decade:

    99/00
    1 Man Utd
    2 Arsenal
    3 Leeds Utd
    4 Liverpool (Chelsea 5th)

    00/01
    1 Man Utd
    2 Arsenal
    3 Liverpool
    4 Leeds Utd (Chelsea 6th)

    01/02
    1 Arsenal
    2 Liverpool
    3 Man Utd
    4 Newcastle Utd (Chelsea 6th)

    02/03
    1 Man Utd
    2 Arsenal
    3 Newcastle Utd
    4 Chelsea (Liverpool 5th)

    03/04
    1 Arsenal
    2 Chelsea
    3 Man Utd
    4 Liverpool

    04/05
    1 Chelsea
    2 Arsenal
    3 Man Utd
    4 Everton (Liverpool 5th)

    05/06
    1 Chelsea
    2 Man Utd
    3 Liverpool
    4 Arsenal

    Out of 28 possible Champions League spots the big four have occupied 23 of them. Despite being such a leviathan I'd say Chelsea's position is the most precarious, dependant as it is on Uncle Roman's billions.
    What I don't understand is how can the EPL then be deemed the best and most exciting league in the world, when the title race from game 1 is for the most part down to 3-4 clubs? 5-6 if we want to be generous. Its ridiculous, and the one thing I hate about the EPL.

    I love how the AFL equalises teams, and every club must rebuild at one stage. Brisbane Lions put out one of the greatest teams of all time from 2001-2004 with four straight Grand Final appearances, three of those resulting in premierships. Yet in the last two years they have not made the finals, and many are predicting a bottom 3 finish for them this year.

    Similarly West Coast were at the bottom of the scrap heap 5-6 years ago, and have made clear progress since then. In 2003 and 2004 they managed to fight back and made finals, and in 2005 and 2006 they have made the Grand Final twice, winning last year's.

    Fair enough there are stories of continued mediocrity such as Richmond, Hawthorn etc., but it was only six years ago that both those clubs made the preliminary finals, and one of them was a kick away from a Grand Final.

    I don't understand how year in year out it can be exciting seeing most teams struggle for mid-table status, whilst your Man U, Arsenal, Liverpool etc. dominate the league.
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  11. #41
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Matteh's Avatar
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    Most other teams in the league are capable of beating the top teams on their day, but it's consistency and the money to have larger squads that sees the big teams dominate.
    The gap between the EPL and Division 1 is the annoying thing, so so wide that clubs struggle so much to stay up.

  12. #42
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    There's as many fans for non-Prem clubs as Prem clubs. Biggest argument against franchising the top flight for me.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    What I don't understand is how can the EPL then be deemed the best and most exciting league in the world, when the title race from game 1 is for the most part down to 3-4 clubs? 5-6 if we want to be generous. Its ridiculous, and the one thing I hate about the EPL.
    The Prem has had 4 different winners since it was invented. Not a lot, no, but not too bad when compared with some other top leagues.

    AFAIC, the fact that the same teams are usually up there is if anything a good thing, as it makes it more of an achievement when a team manages to break the monopoly (Blackburn in 1995, Newcastle very nearly in 1996).

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
    The gap between the EPL and Division 1 is the annoying thing, so so wide that clubs struggle so much to stay up.
    Hardly impossible though - Reading and Wigan have demonstrated that.

  15. #45
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Samuel_Vimes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Halsey View Post
    AFAIC, the fact that the same teams are usually up there is if anything a good thing, as it makes it more of an achievement when a team manages to break the monopoly (Blackburn in 1995, Newcastle very nearly in 1996).
    Spot the top-four supporter...

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