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Thread: Ed Paynter - the most under-rated player ever?

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    World Traveller Craig's Avatar
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    Ed Paynter - the most under-rated player ever?

    Well was Eddie Paynter the most under-rated player of all time?

    Having a look at his record tells the story of a very good batsman at Test and FC level, and finished with a Test average of 59.23, and a Test average 84.25, but got the runs when his side really needed them. He even took the gloves once with no experience ever and did a fantastic job.

    At FC level - he made 20,075 runs @ 42.26 with 45 FC tonnes and a HS of 322 (in five hours ). If he was playing now, he would probably be considered a great player (of course if he was just as successfull), yet never got a go by England selectors.

    Certainly by his record he looked like a genius batsman, yet won't get mentioned as one of the greats to the fact he played 20 Tests, so IMO he would be one of the most under-rated players of all time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig
    finished with a Test average of 59.23, and a Test average 84.25
    He had two Test averages? Wow! Even Bradman only had one.
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    Hall of Fame Member steds's Avatar
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    Agreed, he was extemely under-rated and a fine sevant to the mighty Lancashire, but...
    a)he made his test debut at the age of 29.
    b)Back then they played less cricket
    c)And WWII started the year he played his last test, so he lost the last years of his career
    ...can you see why he had a short career?

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    Cricketer Of The Year James90's Avatar
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    so IMO he would be one of the most under-rated players of all time
    Vinod Kambli for mine
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    International Regular a massive zebra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James90
    Vinod Kambli for mine
    Kambli was dropped because his mentality was questionable and he had a major weakness against the short ball which was being exposed at test level.

    First 7 Tests: 793 runs at 113.29 with 4 centuries
    Lat 10 Tests: 291 runs at 22.38 with 0 centuries.

    Sometimes you have to look beyond overall career figures and in Kambli's case I believe it is incorrect to say 'an average of 54 is an average of 54.' If Kambli had played many more tests he certainly would not have kept his fine career record.
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    SJS
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    Quote Originally Posted by James90
    Vinod Kambli for mine
    Kambli was NEVER under rated. He will rank very high in the list of great initial potentials that fizzled out !!

    When he was performing he was considered a talent fit enough to rank alongside Sachin. That is hardly under rating him.

    His later rating (or lack of it) is brought on by his performance and attitude (take your pick as to which was worse).

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    International Regular a massive zebra's Avatar
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    How is your book coming along Mr SJS?

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    SJS
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    Quote Originally Posted by a massive zebra
    How is your book coming along Mr SJS?
    Slow

    Requires lots of time.

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    World Traveller Craig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mxyzptlk
    He had two Test averages? Wow! Even Bradman only had one.
    Ok he averaged 84 against Australia, my typo.

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig
    Ok he averaged 84 against Australia, my typo.
    Wow. That's better than Bradman too!

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    SJS
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    Under-rated is a bit difficult to define. It is relative. Bradman would be under-rated if we called him a mere great

    We really have lots of players down history who have been greater thanwhat we remember them to be, (a look back in history is not always 20:20 like hindsight).

    Patsy Hendren was another awesome player not always talked of with awe.

    Archie Jackson is an unknown amongst most.

    Trumper is legendry but not appreciated by the modern fan outside Australia.

    Ranji is better remembered for his leg glance and for 'never having played a christian stroke' than for the awesome cricketer that he was.

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    SJS
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS
    Under-rated is a bit difficult to define. It is relative. Bradman would be under-rated if we called him a mere great
    Then again, the one day format and emphasis on allrounders and quick scoring has changed how we look at wicket keepers.

    Evans, Oldfield even Taylor from more recent times are less likely to find favour against Gilchrist or even Knott.

    Future generations will be luckier than us, they wont have to rely only on the authenticity 9read lack of exaggeration) of the written word thanks to the moving picture.

    Thank God future generations will not be able to run down Viv Richards by saying he wasnt as good as he is made out to be and see the difference in the batting of Steve and Marc Waugh through more than the narrow prism of their career averages.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by a massive zebra
    Kambli was dropped because his mentality was questionable and he had a major weakness against the short ball which was being exposed at test level.

    First 7 Tests: 793 runs at 113.29 with 4 centuries
    Lat 10 Tests: 291 runs at 22.38 with 0 centuries.

    Sometimes you have to look beyond overall career figures and in Kambli's case I believe it is incorrect to say 'an average of 54 is an average of 54.' If Kambli had played many more tests he certainly would not have kept his fine career record.
    Same thing applies to Lance Gibbs.
    People look at his career average of 29.something and think "he transcended statistics" when in fact he had the outstanding average of 23.something for the first 10 years of his Test-career and dropped off horribly with only brief moments from then on as pitches were covered and he got older.
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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig
    Well was Eddie Paynter the most under-rated player of all time?

    Having a look at his record tells the story of a very good batsman at Test and FC level, and finished with a Test average of 59.23, and a Test average 84.25, but got the runs when his side really needed them. He even took the gloves once with no experience ever and did a fantastic job.

    At FC level - he made 20,075 runs @ 42.26 with 45 FC tonnes and a HS of 322 (in five hours ). If he was playing now, he would probably be considered a great player (of course if he was just as successfull), yet never got a go by England selectors.

    Certainly by his record he looked like a genius batsman, yet won't get mentioned as one of the greats to the fact he played 20 Tests, so IMO he would be one of the most under-rated players of all time.
    While undoubtedly a very, very fine player, his First-Class average suggests a player who played a small amount of Test-cricket and started with a bang (at a late age). His career was then ended prematurely, but it meant he had an everso-slightly inflated average.

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    World Traveller Craig's Avatar
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    I'm not just soley talking about his average in Tests, I mean he certainly was successfull given his short Test career. I'm surprised he didn't play Test cricket until he was 29, so he was obviously a late bloomer.

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