The man for a crisis?

[marc71178]

With Nasser's retirement, Cricinfo decided to look into the batsmen to get their team out of a hole.

A hole was defined as being 25-1, 50-2, 75-3 or 100-4 (max runs at that wicket fall) and the results were quite interesting.

Ricky Ponting came up top with an average of 60, compared with his career average of 54.72 and Hussain second (41.32 vs. 37.19)

Interestingly, the 2 worst highlighted were none other than Steve Waugh and Rahul Dravid...

[Cloete]

Originally Posted by marc71178

With Nasser's retirement, Cricinfo decided to look into the batsmen to get their team out of a hole.

A hole was defined as being 25-1, 50-2, 75-3 or 100-4 (max runs at that wicket fall) and the results were quite interesting.

Ricky Ponting came up top with an average of 60, compared with his career average of 54.72 and Hussain second (41.32 vs. 37.19)

Interestingly, the 2 worst highlighted were none other than Steve Waugh and Rahul Dravid...

Interesting.... I was triyng to explain this before to liam

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Originally Posted by Cloete

Interesting.... I was triyng to explain this before to liam

And did I ever deny it?

For the information of others, he refers to our Lara v Ponting argument. I can't understand how anyone could rate Ponting level with Lara, let alone better than him, but Cloete tends to suggest it. For the record, the referred to article (here ) states that Lara has scored 19% of his team's runs. Only Bradman and Headly are higher. Suffice to say, Ponting is nowhere near.

[Waughney]

And that's due to the fact that players in Ponting's team can actually score runs (and just for the record IMO Lara is still better than Ponting)

[bennyr]

That is really interesting. If you'd have asked me who I wanted coming in at 3/58 I'd have given you either Allan Border or Steve Waugh.

Yet another one of my firmly held beliefs debunked.

[Waughney]

I don't entirely agree with this statistic. Steve Waughs average is still 3 higher than Hussain's and Ponting usually comes in with only 1 wicket down, before pressure is really on.

[Jnr.]

Interesting, to say the least. I went and searched up when Ponting has scored a century and the situation he walks in at:

Batting at No. 6:
127 - 4/50 - Eng
105 - 4/77 - SA
104 - 4/144 - WI
105* - 4/183 - SL
197 - 4/54 - Pak
125 - 4/52 - Ind
141* - 4/267 - Ind

Batting at No. 3:
144 - 1/39 - Eng
157* - 1/223 - NZ
100* - 1/102 - SA
141 - 1/5 - Pak
150 - 1/4 - Pak
123 - 1/67 - Eng
154 - 1/101 - Eng
117 - 1/37 - WI
206 - 1/49 - WI
113 - 1/43 - WI
169 - 1/7 - Zim
242 - 1/22 - Ind
257 - 1/30 - Ind

I am even more surprised that SRW had a lower average, maybe it has something to do with his red inks.

[Langeveldt]

Interesting...

[Hoggy]

I thought I would do a profile of a certain player that I thought might have cracked a bit under pressure, the following is Damien Martyn.

Test #2  2nd Test v WI  92/93 2nd inn - Batted at 6, 4-73, made 67*
Test #4  5th Test v WI  92/93 2nd inn - Batted at 6, 4-67, made 31
Test #5  3rd Test @ NZ  92/93 1st inn - Batted at 4, 2-38, made 1
"     "   "    "  "  "    "   2nd inn - Batted at 4, 2-8,  made 74
Test #8  1st Test @ NZ  99/00 2nd inn - Batted at 6, 4-81, made 36
Test #11 3rd Test v WI  00/01 2nd inn - Batted at 6, 4-48, made 34*
Test #14 3rd Test @ Eng 2001  1st inn - Batted at 6, 4-82, made 4
Test #25 3rd Test @ SAF 01/02 2nd inn - Batted at 6, 4-90, made 0
Test #26 1st Test @ Pak 02/03 2nd inn - Batted at 6, 4-74, made 20
Test #29 1st Test v Eng 02/03 2nd inn - Batted at 4, 2-39, made 64
Test #33 5th Test v Eng 02/03 1st inn - Batted at 4, 2-45, made 26
Test #37 2nd Test v Ind 03/04 2nd inn - Batted at 4, 2-18, made 38
Test #41 2nd Test v SL  03/04 1st inn - Batted at 4, 2-47, made 1
"     "   "   "   "  "    "   2nd inn - Batted at 4, 2-26, made 161

14    innings
2     not outs
557   runs
161   highest score
3     50's
1     100
46.42 average


Real Stats = 
67    innings
10    not outs
2672  runs
161   highest score
15    50's
7     100's
46.87 average

The last hundred he made certainly saved his under pressure average a bit there didn't it?

[bennyr]

Originally Posted by Hoggy

14 innings
2 not outs
557 runs
161 highest score
3 50's
1 100
46.42 average


Real Stats =
67 innings
10 not outs
2672 runs
161 highest score
15 50's
7 100's
46.87 average[/code]


The last hundred he made certainly saved his under pressure average a bit there didn't it?

Be careful, you'll wake Linda up.

To me, that list reads pretty much like Martyn's entire career - lots of scores between 30 and 70. I kinda think that having Martyn coming in in a crisis is OK - he's not likely to dig you out of it with a great century but he's equally unlikely (up until last summer) to be the next batsmen in a middle order collapse.

And if he can regain that sort of form he will continue to be a great foil for the 2, 178, 13, 0, 208 sort of scoring we see from our illustrious Test captain

[marc71178]

Originally Posted by Waughney

I don't entirely agree with this statistic. Steve Waughs average is still 3 higher than Hussain's and Ponting usually comes in with only 1 wicket down, before pressure is really on.

Yes, but his record under pressure is worse than his overall record, suggesting he's not as good under pressure (relatively) as the general impression is.

[PY]

Originally Posted by bennyr

Be careful, you'll wake Linda up.

To me, that list reads pretty much like Martyn's entire career - lots of scores between 30 and 70. I kinda think that having Martyn coming in in a crisis is OK - he's not likely to dig you out of it with a great century but he's equally unlikely (up until last summer) to be the next batsmen in a middle order collapse.

And if he can regain that sort of form he will continue to be a great foil for the 2, 178, 13, 0, 208 sort of scoring we see from our illustrious Test captain

You make a good point, Martyn is someone who I always see as someone who can steady the ship (if not fix it) if things aren't going too well. He also has the ability to make the ship fly (to continue the theme).

[Langeveldt]

Originally Posted by PY

He also has the ability to make the ship fly (to continue the theme).

Hahaha

[Linda]

Originally Posted by bennyr

Be careful, you'll wake Linda up.

To me, that list reads pretty much like Martyn's entire career - lots of scores between 30 and 70. I kinda think that having Martyn coming in in a crisis is OK - he's not likely to dig you out of it with a great century but he's equally unlikely (up until last summer) to be the next batsmen in a middle order collapse.

And if he can regain that sort of form he will continue to be a great foil for the 2, 178, 13, 0, 208 sort of scoring we see from our illustrious Test captain

I'm awake

Martyn's scores aren't spectacular, ala Ponting, but they are consistant. I'll never understand the people who say that not scoring a Test century in two years, and yet still maintaining a 40 average, is not good enough.
And as for the constant talk about him not being good under pressure, I really cant see that either. Yeah, sure the century at the end "saved his average", but he still did it!! Dont get me wrong, I wouldnt say he's the best player to send out there is a real crunch situation, but I'd send him out there ahead of alot of other players...

[SJS]

Originally Posted by marc71178

Yes, but his record under pressure is worse than his overall record, suggesting he's not as good under pressure (relatively) as the general impression is.

That maybe true. But I think his perception as the man for a crisis has to do with the times that he has dug in and gone on to score real big ones and these have been quite a few. So instead of just looking at averages of all innings under crisis, one needs to look at the number of times he has gone on to play a real long lone-ranger's hand. This is what made his reputation.