Why isn't Imran rated higher?

[Coronis]

That home record of Imran during his halcyon years comes with an asterisk the size of the sun. No getting away from that.

He was before my time as a follower of the sport, but even so, there aren't very many accounts of the type of bowler he was - the way people associate yorkers and swing with his compatriots Wasim and Waqar, nagging line and bounce and seam with McGrath and Ambrose etc. What was his bowling shtick?

He was similar to Wasim and Waqar iirc, swinging and yorking.

 

[Burgey]

That home record of Imran during his halcyon years comes with an asterisk the size of the sun. No getting away from that.

He was before my time as a follower of the sport, but even so, there aren't very many accounts of the type of bowler he was - the way people associate yorkers and swing with his compatriots Wasim and Waqar, nagging line and bounce and seam with McGrath and Ambrose etc. What was his bowling shtick?

Could peel an orange one handed with a bottle top. That and home umpires like Shakoor Rana. Sums it up.

 

[smash84]

That home record of Imran during his halcyon years comes with an asterisk the size of the sun. No getting away from that.

He was before my time as a follower of the sport, but even so, there aren't very many accounts of the type of bowler he was - the way people associate yorkers and swing with his compatriots Wasim and Waqar, nagging line and bounce and seam with McGrath and Ambrose etc. What was his bowling shtick?

He was very good. He taught wasim how to bowl the yorker (although wasim became better at it) and he was as good with reverse swing as Wasim and Waqar. A lot of issues people with reverse swing also had to do with sour grapes. As soon as the other teams learnt how to do it well it suddenly became an "art".

Besides almost every country had terrible umpiring back then so put an asterisk before everybody's record. Pakistan didn't win in the WI in the 1980s thanks to patriotic umpiring too.

His most lethal delivery was probably his reverse swinging in dipper. Would come into the batsmen at searing pace with very late movement. Not much you could do about it when it was on target.

 

[smash84]

Could peel an orange one handed with a bottle top. That and home umpires like Shakoor Rana. Sums it ups.

Seemed like he was much more skilled with them than some players are with sandpaper.

 

[Burgey]

He was very fortunate that most countries had one camera covering the game back then, rather than the 50 odd they have now. He'd have basically sat out the entire 1980s otherwise. Ask anyone who played with him at NSW in the 80s about what "skills" he taught the playing group. I'm sat at my desk here looking out at the Connaught as I type this, where Imran stayed for those two seasons, and there are still old, rusted bottle tops in the rooftop pool area. They frame and sell them as memorabilia.

 

[kyear2]

Could peel an orange one handed with a bottle top. That and home umpires like Shakoor Rana. Sums it ups.

Basically.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

At one point in the near past I confused him with the late Muammar Gaddafi.

 

[Burgey]

Gaddafi probably a better batsman, but Imran a moderate upgrade as a politician.

 

[mr_mister]

Miagra is one of my favourite posters

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Miagra is one of my favourite posters

Sig worthy. Just saying.

 

[Migara]

At one point in the near past I confused him with the late Muammar Gaddafi.

Apt compari8son because Imran also became a head of state.

 

[Coronis]

Apt compari8son because Imran also became a head of state.

Oh good, I was confused.

 

[Athlai]

He was very fortunate that most countries had one camera covering the game back then, rather than the 50 odd they have now. He'd have basically sat out the entire 1980s otherwise. Ask anyone who played with him at NSW in the 80s about what "skills" he taught the playing group. I'm sat at my desk here looking out at the Connaught as I type this, where Imran stayed for those two seasons, and there are still old, rusted bottle tops in the rooftop pool area. They frame and sell them as memorabilia.

Ball tampering is definitely utterly despicable. Ban the lot.

 

[TheJediBrah]

He was very good. He taught wasim how to bowl the yorker (although wasim became better at it) and he was as good with reverse swing as Wasim and Waqar. A lot of issues people with reverse swing also had to do with sour grapes. As soon as the other teams learnt how to do it well it suddenly became an "art".

Besides almost every country had terrible umpiring back then so put an asterisk before everybody's record. Pakistan didn't win in the WI in the 1980s thanks to patriotic umpiring too.

His most lethal delivery was probably his reverse swinging in dipper. Would come into the batsmen at searing pace with very late movement. Not much you could do about it when it was on target.

Nah it's pretty widely accepted that Pakistan was in it's on league in that regard, as unpalatable as that may be to you

Wow, Erapali Prasanna, Chandrashekar, Qadir, Kumble, Murali, Mushtaq, Saqlain and Ashwin are useless.

What do all those bowlers have in common? From subcontinent. Of course passion for spin bowling never went away when you play on those pitches. Burgey is clearly talking about the rest of the world, that should have been obvious.

 

[Burgey]

Wow, Erapali Prasanna, Chandrashekar, Qadir, Kumble, Murali, Mushtaq, Saqlain and Ashwin are useless. Pace never had the stranglehold in subcontinent, and it never required Warne for that. Even Warne was erased from the timeline, still above bowlers would have rode the tide beautifully.

On second thought yes, now players are not stupid enough to dope or dope and cover them selves and cry "Ma mamma gave it" sentiments.

Typical Migara wahhhhing and ignorance here. Most of those you mention and Lance Gibbs played either before or in conjunction with the great era of pace bowling (cricket's best era, without question), albeit Kumble and Mushtaq right at end of it. Each of them could only dream of having the impact Warne did on the game. Murali and Saqlain of course came along and started javelin throwing a bit later, when Warne had already done all the heavy lifting in ending the dominance of pace bowling. Ashwin started twenty odd years later ffs and can't even get a start .

As for the crying sentiment, I mean your fellas cried so loud they changed a law of the game for Murali. Otherwise he'd have been quite rightly banned.

 

[rtramdas]

More like . . . .
View attachment 25036

'sour grapes' !!!!!!!!! ..... you accuse me of 'sour grapes' w.r.t Vivian Richards or Jacques Kallis ......I would readily accept it any time, if I have any. This is because I consider both of them as better to any cricketer than my country has ever produced. But not for this chronic ball tamperor who was accused by at least 15 cricket related people. If needed, I can name these people any time with enough links & documents & circumstantial evidences.So much for 'sour
grapes'......

 

[Prince EWS]

'sour grapes' !!!!!!!!! ..... you accuse me of 'sour grapes' w.r.t Vivian Richards or Jacques Kallis ......I would readily accept it any time, if I have any. This is because I consider both of them as better to any cricketer than my country has ever produced. But not for this chronic ball tamperor who was accused by at least 15 cricket related people. If needed, I can name these people any time with enough links & documents & circumstantial evidences.So much for 'sour
grapes'......

I think he was accusing Botham of sour grapes rather than you.

And probably fair enough too. Botham is a noted wanker. He was a good cricketer (and an amazing one for a short period) but I've heard enough of his commentary to know I don't care too much for his opinions of others.

 

[rtramdas]

I think he was accusing Botham of sour grapes rather than you.

And probably fair enough too. Botham is a noted wanker. He was a good cricketer (and an amazing one for a short period) but I've heard enough of his commentary to know I don't care too much for his opinions of others.

may be what you said about Botham is true. But still when it comes to Imran, there is lot more to it . When a lot of even his own countrymen let alone other nationals, have provided testimonies w.r.t Imran's expertise at one moment or the other, you have to give it to Botham in this regard.

 

[Bolo.]

Typical Migara wahhhhing and ignorance here. Most of those you mention and Lance Gibbs played either before or in conjunction with the great era of pace bowling (cricket's best era, without question), albeit Kumble and Mushtaq right at end of it. Each of them could only dream of having the impact Warne did on the game. Murali and Saqlain of course came along and started javelin throwing a bit later, when Warne had already done all the heavy lifting in ending the dominance of pace bowling. Ashwin started twenty odd years later ffs and can't even get a start .

As for the crying sentiment, I mean your fellas cried so loud they changed a law of the game for Murali. Otherwise he'd have been quite rightly banned.

We clearly shouldn't underestimate the impact of Warne's only wicket in his debut series before Murali played his first series against Warne in his second. That wicket clearly broke the dominance of pace.

 

[Burgey]

It did

You don’t know what you’re talking about here unless you watched a lot of cricket in the 70s and 80s in a first order cricket country rather than a faux one.

Away from the second order nations, pace ruled everything, as it rightfully should. Lillee started that era. Warne ended it.

Do you really think a bloke literally standing there and rightly getting being called for shot putting had the same transcendental effect on the sport? Do you think any captain of a proper test nation thought “See this fella who’s been no balled out of the game? Fmd we’ll pick more spinners”? Of course not. JFC man. Come on.