***Official*** New Zealand Domestic Season 2019/20

[HeathDavisSpeed]

O'Rourke from Auckland looks alright. The second wicket look good (bowled Lellman), the first wicket looked like he was collapsing/falling away in his action and it was a bit floaty.

First mention of O'Rourke on CW? I assume it's the same one as he used to live in Auckland.

Also worth noting nzfan stating that Wellington's T Robinson is a fairly quick bowler.

As for Wellington, T Robinson is a fairly quick bowler. Still in school but plays for Onslow Club.

J Tashkoff has been leading the NZ 19 team and a good all rounder. Bowls tidy left arm orthodox and a decent bat.

 

[Flem274*]

First mention of O'Rourke on CW? I assume it's the same one as he used to live in Auckland.

Also worth noting nzfan stating that Wellington's T Robinson is a fairly quick bowler.

Yup. Immenso spotted him in Under 19s.

 

[straw man]

I remember him from NZ U19s, though it looks like Immenso might be talking about Auckland (edited) U19s which would pre-date that.

It would be awesome if anyone could dig up a clip of him bowling from NZ U19s, when his arm used to come through behind his head (hard to explain). Has lost the huge inswing that generated but otherwise has made huge strides.

 

[straw man]

Lots to like there.

Do quite like O'Rourke's bowling too, even if there currently aren't a lot of straight lines in his bowling action. Has potential - a do-er upper.

Yeah even sort of looks a bit like a South African seamer to me, O'Rourke, which of course is where NZ U19 are headed. The selectors have got themselves into a bit of a bind now by trying to cultivate ND kids, when the answers were actually O'Rourke and Millard. The old ND cry-wolfing tricks seem to have struck again in a bad way.

Here we go - O'Rourke U19s. Bowling action then was not actually as ungainly as I remembered - just had head fall away a lot.

 

[straw man]

Well you can sort of see why they never really had any serious plans for O'Rourke when you watch the action from behind him.

What they may need to appreciate is that they could actually thrive with a bit more unorthodoxy and weird one-of-a-kind actions etc. in their pace bowlers, especially for one-off tournaments. I mean O'Rourke's ERs in these age group tourneys has never been bad, in fact quite the opposite.

another one

 

[SteveNZ]

Has always had that natural angle into RHers/across LHers which even when he's not swinging/seaming it presents a challenge. Couple that with the bounce, pretty good pace and does hit the strings, he's definitely a huge prospect. Hopefully has a lot of improvement in him, too.

The Bedingham dismissal yesterday was a clear sign of his value. If that's a Henry/Southee etc, that's a comfortable back foot punch but O'Rourke got lift on a wearing wicket with a 65-over old ball.

 

[straw man]

One interesting thing (to me anyway) is I struggle to think of a bowler from any country in the last 25 years with a bowling action very similar to O'Rourke's (even his 2024 slightly more orthodox action). I guess because it's a mixed action, sort of wants to be an inswing bowler but has modified that so he gets a touch of shape in but then may seam the ball either direction.

Most other bowlers have an easy enough comparison. Jamieson is Chris Tremlett, for example. Anyone have one for O'Rourke?

 

[Immenso]

Good smarts by O'Rourke to move to uni in Canterbury and get access to that good coaching (like Jamieson's path).

IIRC, I'm pretty sure I have heard or read O'Rourke crediting Dayle Hadlee (if I'm not mixing him up with Big Kyle, who I know also did this).

Toby Hart, Jarrod McKay. move north.

 

[Prince EWS]

another one

Opposite mention. @TheJediBrah

 

[Immenso]

Although in a more serious post than just "move to Canterbury".

I mean Canterbury have a seam bowling depth chart of

Henry
Jamieson
O'Rourke
Shipley
Foulkes
Rae
Sheat

How do we get that good coaching spread around?

Is it just a freak/coincidence for this concentration at Canterbury at the moment? Rather like the CD young seamers of 2010.

Is it the luck of having the HPC at Lincoln, and are they're actually good at coaching now at Lincoln rather than the horror show of Ric Charlesworth's frankenstein's baby.

There is an almost de-facto HPC level facility at Mt Maunganui now, in terms of indoor proper turf nets etc. But it is run by ND rather than NZC as far as I know.

But instead of being the place where seamers come to get awesome, The Mount is the place where old seamers on NZ central contracts move to ND - so that they can phone-in their last few years so they don't have to do so much domestic-travel (between weeks jetting overseas from AIA).

How can we get a North Island HPC of the same quality as Lincoln? Is it as simple as one man's salary by NZC and put him in Tauranga? What extra kit do they have at Lincoln that they don't have at The Mount?

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

How can we get a North Island HPC of the same quality as Lincoln? Is it as simple as one man's salary by NZC and put him in Tauranga? What extra kit do they have at Lincoln that they don't have at The Mount?

What do they have at the new NZCIS in Upper Hutt in the way of cricket facilities? I understand they have some really top notch stuff out there, but that would be the obvious place in the Lower North Island, I would think.

 

[Immenso]

What do they have at the new NZCIS in Upper Hutt in the way of cricket facilities? I understand they have some really top notch stuff out there, but that would be the obvious place in the Lower North Island, I would think.

Hadn't heard of it. But looking at the website doesn't look to have any cricket specific facilities.
But would be an obvious place. But need turf wicket wickets with the Foryth-Barr type material marquee.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Hadn't heard of it. But looking at the website doesn't look to have any cricket specific facilities.
But would be an obvious place. But need turf wicket wickets with the Foryth-Barr type material marquee.

Hmmm. Perhaps there's just not the space out there. There's been tons of new housing put up around that region of Upper Hutt in the last few years, but Trentham Memorial Park or even the infield of the Trentham Racing Club are nearby and offer extensive grassy areas. The other direction, the grassy areas are in the vicinity of Remutaka Gaol, unfortunately.

 

[Immenso]

Hmmm. Perhaps there's just not the space out there. There's been tons of new housing put up around that region of Upper Hutt in the last few years, but Trentham Memorial Park or even the infield of the Trentham Racing Club are nearby and offer extensive grassy areas. The other direction, the grassy areas are in the vicinity of Remutaka Gaol, unfortunately.

The website shows they have 4 international-quality football fields. So, there is space.

World Class Turf

Offer a selection of indoor and outdoor fields built to international competition specifications with full lighting, cameras, viewing and warm-up areas, and analysis equipment.

www.nzcis.co.nz

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

The website shows they have 4 international-quality football fields. So, there is space.

World Class Turf

Offer a selection of indoor and outdoor fields built to international competition specifications with full lighting, cameras, viewing and warm-up areas, and analysis equipment.

www.nzcis.co.nz

Nice. I did get an invite to go and tour the place, but was away tramping at the time. I know they have the "Green Room" which is a 50m x 70m indoor training space (see picture 2 here: https://architecturehdt.co.nz/portfolio/nzcisperformanceinstitute). That has the capacity for a lot of indoor cricket training.

 

[straw man]

I mean Canterbury have a seam bowling depth chart of

Henry
Jamieson
O'Rourke
Shipley
Foulkes
Rae
Sheat

Is it just a freak/coincidence for this concentration at Canterbury at the moment? Rather like the CD young seamers of 2010.

Don't know the general answer to this question, but as you know two (Jamieson, O'Rourke) of the above bowlers originated from Auckland and moved down to Canterbury*. I know it's long been a thing that a lot of Auckland's top young players go elsewhere in NZ to get opportunities. That would be quite understandable if it was because Auckland's domestic sides was just so stacked and dominant that young players couldn't break in, and Auckland was continually producing NZ players at a higher rate than anywhere else. But it isn't and they aren't.

Instead young Auckland players like Jamieson and O'Rourke move elsewhere (esp ND and Canterbury) because that's how you get to the next level, probably the best coaching and facilities. So it seems to me like it's mainly Auckland cricket that's underperforming.

* quick check says the others all originated in Canterbury except Rae from Dunedin

 

[Immenso]

A point wiht the current Canterbury bowling depth. Is that Canterbury Country is currently very strong. And Foulkes, Sheat, Shipley have played quite a lot of Hawke Cup cricket on their ways up. Which is a bit of an advantage (over Auckland and Wellington) now that 'A' cricket has dried up to an extent.

Hawke Cup cricket is great. Can sometimes be quite dire to watch/follow because of first innings wins being the best default option, but that is tough cricket.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Do Wellington have any Hawke Cup representation these days? Can't remember the last time Hutt Valley played a game, for example.

 

[Flem274*]

Hawke Cup is directly responsible for the cd and ND dynasties of results and players imo.

Even when the black caps go on tour, there's a surprisingly good replacement. The city club cricketers tend to need a bit more time to adapt.

 

[Immenso]

Do Wellington have any Hawke Cup representation these days? Can't remember the last time Hutt Valley played a game, for example.

They exited in 2000

Hutt Valley breaks with long Hawke Cup tradition

Hutt Valley will no longer be part of Hawke Cup minor association cricket

www.espncricinfo.com