Best Ever ODI XI

[Loony BoB]

There is no question about Rhodes fielding as its very good.

But the problem is that perhaps people would find it hard to find a spot for him in their side because he batted most times (90 innings) at No.5 in his ODI career. Now Michael Bevan has to be the first player picked in any best ODI XI so he would probably be best suited at No.5. You would also want to have your top four batsmen averaging more than Rhodes (35.11). So where do you play Rhodes, at No.6 or do you put an all rounder in at No.6? Now that would pose a selection problem for many people.

Of course, at the same time, would he save 10 runs that another player would not? Almost certainly. That effectively adds ten runs to his average. People never think about things in that way, but with overall value, you have to consider the amount that they will add to their team's score and also the amount that they will remove from the opponent's score.

Gilchrist (wk)
Tendulkar
Bevan
Ponting
Richards
Rhodes
Klusener
Warne
McGrath
Akram
Bond

Others I considered: Murali, Ambrose, Donald, Cairns, S. Pollock, PA de Silva.

Not sure if I really have the bowlers right - the main four are fine, but that still leaves ten overs. I guess it'll do, at least for about ten minutes thought on my lunch break.

 

[tooextracool]

Gilchrist (wk)
Tendulkar
Bevan
Ponting
Richards
Rhodes
Klusener
Warne
McGrath
Akram
Bond

no garner?i dont think theyve been too many bowlers as good as garner in the history of ODI cricket let alone better than him.

 

[a massive zebra]

England have not been represented in any of the best ever ODI teams.

West Indies, South Africa, Sri Lanka, New Zealand, India, Pakistan and Australia are all represented with a good mix.

My Best Ever England ODI Team

NV Knight
ME Trescothick
GA Hick (cpt)
NH Fairbrother
RA Smith
AJ Stewart (wk)
IT Botham
A Flintoff
D Gough
RGD Willis
DL Underwood

12th Man: GP Thorpe

 

[twctopcat]

Clive Lloyd's ODI Batting & fielding Record
87 Matches, 1977 runs@ 39.54, SR: 81.22, Ct: 39 (average of 0.448 catches per match)

Jonty Rhodes ODI Batting & fielding Record
245 Matches, 5935 runs@ 35.11, SR: 80.91, Ct: 105 (average of 0.428 catches per match)

Well if I had to choose whether to pick Lloyd or Rhodes as 12th Man, I would probably go for Rhodes as he has performed just about as well as Lloyd over a much longer ODI career. I also think that Rhodes was a better fielder than Lloyd.

Lloyd couldn't have helped the fact he played relatively so little, ODI were played less frequently back then, yet his record is still very good. Obviously jonty is the best point/gully fielder probably ever but u keep Lloyd there for his superb captaincy. He led the west indies to the first world cup showing the ability to adapt to the shorter game better than anyone else.. His performance there alone shows how much of a winner he was, smashing the australian attack to his century which rescued that innings. If he had played more i have no doubt he would have been as consistent, after all he was in the test game.

 

[a massive zebra]

Lloyd couldn't have helped the fact he played relatively so little, ODI were played less frequently back then, yet his record is still very good. Obviously jonty is the best point/gully fielder probably ever but u keep Lloyd there for his superb captaincy. He led the west indies to the first world cup showing the ability to adapt to the shorter game better than anyone else.. His performance there alone shows how much of a winner he was, smashing the australian attack to his century which rescued that innings. If he had played more i have no doubt he would have been as consistent, after all he was in the test game.

Lloyd wasn't a good captain he captained a good side. His lack of success as captain of Lancashire illustrates his tactical naiveity (sp).

 

[Ford_GTHO351]

Of course, at the same time, would he save 10 runs that another player would not? Almost certainly. That effectively adds ten runs to his average.

I see your point.

Though I could also say that by including a batsman that scores/averages much more runs (than Rhodes) could compensate for Rhodes not being in the field.

You can look at it from both sides of the fence.

 

[Loony BoB]

no garner?i dont think theyve been too many bowlers as good as garner in the history of ODI cricket let alone better than him.

Check my sig. xD I don't know much about past players, to be blunt, but I do try. Now I have been educated - maybe I'd consider swapping McGrath for Garner. Of course, once you get to that stage it's just passing one prime-of-their-time bowler for the next.

At the same time, Bond probably won't be in my squad after a few series pass by, unless his 'new bowling action' is just as effective as his old one. Still, going by his current stats, he makes my squad easily - especially considering most of his scores are against Aussie, South Africa, India and the Windies. With best bowling figures of 6/23 and 5/25, averaging 19, and a lovely ol' strike rate of 26.8.

I just realised how messed up my batting order is, too. Someone can feel free to sort it out for me.

 

[Ford_GTHO351]

Gilchrist (wk)
Tendulkar
Bevan
Ponting
Richards
Rhodes
Klusener
Warne
McGrath
Akram
Bond

I don't think that Bond should really be picked in Best ODI XI's just yet considering he has only played in 27 ODI's to date.

 

[tooextracool]

Lloyd couldn't have helped the fact he played relatively so little, ODI were played less frequently back then, yet his record is still very good. Obviously jonty is the best point/gully fielder probably ever but u keep Lloyd there for his superb captaincy. He led the west indies to the first world cup showing the ability to adapt to the shorter game better than anyone else.. His performance there alone shows how much of a winner he was, smashing the australian attack to his century which rescued that innings. If he had played more i have no doubt he would have been as consistent, after all he was in the test game.

but if you had to choose between lloyd and jonty for no 12(which is what twc was looking at) who would you pick? i think a lot of people dont know what kind of impact rhodes had on his team,he was their motivator, without him they seemed to lose that edge.

 

[twctopcat]

Lloyd wasn't a good captain he captained a good side. His lack of success of captain of Lancashire illustrates his tactical naiveity (sp).

Yeah right, think there's only a select band who harbour that type of opinion. Don't know who you're trying to kid with that one. His job got easier but he won the '75 WC that lacked all of the pacers that would soon dominate. Just because he captained a good side does that make him an average captain? I wouldn't call Steve Waugh that even though he was in the same situation during his stint. And just because he didn't dominate with lancashire shows he can't work miracles.

 

[Ford_GTHO351]

Gilchrist (wk)
Tendulkar
Bevan
Ponting
Richards
Rhodes
Klusener
Warne
McGrath
Akram
Bond

Ok, going by the playes you have picked, here is where IMO where they should be in the batting order.

Gilchrist
Tendulkar
Richards
Ponting
Bevan
Rhodes
Klusener
Akram
Warne
Bond
McGrath

 

[Loony BoB]

I don't think that Bond should really be picked in Best ODI XI's just yet considering he has only played in 27 ODI's to date.

Yeah, but I felt that going by current stats he deserved to be in nonetheless - considering I highly doubt you can judge his ability post-injury and post-bowling-method-change. It's like having two completely different bowlers. Going by the form he was in, I think he would have carried on to be one of the best all time bowlers. Stupid people wanting to prolong their careers and save their backs. What's up with that?

EDIT: Thanks for the batting order mixup.

 

[twctopcat]

but if you had to choose between lloyd and jonty for no 12(which is what twc was looking at) who would you pick? i think a lot of people dont know what kind of impact rhodes had on his team,he was their motivator, without him they seemed to lose that edge.

I wouldn't exactly call Lloyd a quiet man in the corner. Although Rhodes was no doubt a great motivator you've got to look at the whole package.

 

[tooextracool]

I see your point.

Though I could also say that by including a batsman that scores/averages much more runs (than Rhodes) could compensate for Rhodes not being in the field.

You can look at it from both sides of the fence.

not too many ODI players who average above 45 are there(adding those 10-15 runs to rhodes average)?dont forget that he pulled off catches that werent there to be caught and was almost like a bowler taking wickets.

 

[Ford_GTHO351]

Now I have been educated - maybe I'd consider swapping McGrath for Garner.

I would IMO if you were to have Garner in your side, you would swap him with Bond, not McGrath.

 

[tooextracool]

Yeah right, think there's only a select band who harbour that type of opinion. Don't know who you're trying to kid with that one. His job got easier but he won the '75 WC that lacked all of the pacers that would soon dominate. Just because he captained a good side does that make him an average captain? I wouldn't call Steve Waugh that even though he was in the same situation during his stint. And just because he didn't dominate with lancashire shows he can't work miracles.

no doubt that lloyd was a good captain but steve waugh was never really anything more than decent. from what i saw in that series against india where his side came in without a plan, the bowlers had no clue what to bowl and steve waugh didnt come up with any ingenious field placings either. was steve waugh a motivator?...yes but was he an intelligent captain?...no

 

[tooextracool]

I wouldn't exactly call Lloyd a quiet man in the corner. Although Rhodes was no doubt a great motivator you've got to look at the whole package.

rhodes was a much better fielder and motivator,IMO he makes up for the difference between their batting abilities

 

[Loony BoB]

Hmm. Who would be the best ODI captain of all time? After all this talk of fielding making a difference, how much of a difference could a brilliant captain make?

 

[tooextracool]

Hmm. Who would be the best ODI captain of all time?

stephen fleming

 

[Ford_GTHO351]

not too many ODI players who average above 45 are there(adding those 10-15 runs to rhodes average)?dont forget that he pulled off catches that werent there to be caught and was almost like a bowler taking wickets.

Best ever ODI career Averages (minimum 20 innings):

MG Bevan: 53.58 from 196 innings
Zaheer Abbas: 47.62 from 60 innings
RR Sarwan: 47.25 from 55 innings
IVA Richards: 47.00 from 167 innings
GM Turner: 47.00 from 40 innings
JH Kallis: 45.90 from 187 innings
CG Greenidge: 45.03 from 127 innings

Though don't think for one moment that I think that Rhodes wasn't a good ODI player. He will go down as one of the best fielders ever. Its just that I look at it from a different perspective than you (or other people).