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1st grade? Crowds at Matador games?

Tom Flint

International Regular
Well of course it isn't. Grade cricket in Australia is like 15-20 teams, per state. County cricket in England is ~18 teams for the whole country. And there is a **** load more people in England than in Australia to choose from as well, and probably a higher proportion of those interested in cricket (that's speculation).
I was only answering the guys original question mate??
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
I would have thought that the biggest reason why there's historically not been as many overseas players is due to timing.

The English season runs (or historically it did) pretty much on its own so people are available.

The Australian season runs in parallel with all the other major nation's seasons and the majority of international tours.
 

Woodster

International Captain
The standard of first grade cricket is Australia always interests me and the slight drop in standards presumably only relates to certain states ?

From what I know, and I haven't played at both levels, is the Aussie first grade cricket is probably in between our Premier Leagues (generally speaking) and county cricket, maybe on a par with county 2nd XI in this country ?

I've spoken with many Aussies that come to our club and play first grade back home, and bizarrely they haven't necessarily done too well for us but then gone home and absolutely dominated, there are of course many reasons for this as generally this is their first experience of English conditions. But they deem their cricket back home as more competitive with regards the standard.

Now the quality of overseas player we will be able to bring over in the future may be hugely compromised by the new Home Office rules not allowing clubs to sign 'pathway' players from abroad, which is truly ridiculous!!
 

Jarquis

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I always find it strange that Australians see their setup as more 'linear' seeing as there's about 300 different competitions with country cricket, warehouse, subdistricts and all the other **** outside of Grade cricket - which is the only one that really matters.

In the UK it pretty much is club -> minor counties/2nd xis -> county cricket.
 

Midwinter

State Captain
I always find it strange that Australians see their setup as more 'linear' seeing as there's about 300 different competitions with country cricket, warehouse, subdistricts and all the other **** outside of Grade cricket - which is the only one that really matters.

In the UK it pretty much is club -> minor counties/2nd xis -> county cricket.
All the local comps are not "outside of grade cricket" but feed into it.

Round this way, there is the local grade comp but if anyone looks any good they are then recruited into a metropolitan grade club to work their way up though the ranks.
 

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
I do not really see the problem with having one overseas player per State side. Surely one slot per squad will not unduly block Australian talent. I really think you Australians are shooting yourselves in the foot here (understand, Australia wouldn't have the kolpak problem England has). It adds a little 'stardust' to proceedings and drums up interest and crowds. Thanks to the overseas policy of the County Championship I have seen Sangakkara on multiple occasions. Just this season I saw James Pattinson take Collingwood's wicket with a devastating spell of bowling.
 

MattPom

Cricket Spectator
One final question I've read Michael Clarke's autobiography. Is he as disliked as much as I've read ?
 

MattPom

Cricket Spectator
Is Sydney the highest standard of grade cricket in Australia? Alot of our players end up there
How do you Aussies view Tasmania. I know Ponting played for them but I read that you think they're weird with 6 fingers. Is that just a joke or You not keen on the place?

Do you have any fierce state rivalries? Do any teams really dislike each other?
 

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
I've always found it interesting how Michael Di Venuto was in both the Tasmania team which won in 2006-07 and the Durham side which won in 2008 and 2009. Tasmania and Durham's situation was basically the same: whippersnapper minions who began punching above their weight claiming their first first-class title.
 
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NUFAN

Y no Afghanistan flag
Has anyone said lack of foreign players is due to there only being 66 spots available compared to 198 in Wales and England.

The JLT (not Matador) is embarrasing that its not on TV. Even NBL and ALeague has a match on FTA each week.
 

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
Has anyone said lack of foreign players is due to there only being 66 spots available compared to 198 in Wales and England.
How many Shield sides are there, six? That is six overseas players for the entire competition if we are assuming a similar one-player-per-team ratio as the county championship. A reduction from 66 to 60 is hardly a big sacrifice considering the benefits of seeing a few big international names enlivening the competition. Trust me, it is brilliant being able to see international duels which you could not possibly see replicated internationally now for the price of a county championship ticket. You are really missing out here.
 

NUFAN

Y no Afghanistan flag
The county season is in the off season for more countries so there would be less talent available.

Also decreasing the pool by 6 is fairly large - you dont particularly want a young guy choosing AFL over Cricket due to lack of opportunities if behind an overseas pro.

From a fan perspective it would be nice though, particularly if the 6 players were household names with ability.
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
What do you think of junior participation atm?
Anecdotal evidence only, but I’d say it’s dipping. PDCA is, I think, the biggest Junior cricket association in Australia and its numbers are a fair bit down on where they were over the decades.
 

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
The county season is in the off season for more countries so there would be less talent available.

Also decreasing the pool by 6 is fairly large - you dont particularly want a young guy choosing AFL over Cricket due to lack of opportunities if behind an overseas pro.

From a fan perspective it would be nice though, particularly if the 6 players were household names with ability.
I do not see six as being that big. Also, you had overseas players once. Why once and not now? I'm sure there were bigger crowds when the Shield had overseas players during the '70s.
 

GotSpin

Hall of Fame Member
Anecdotal evidence only, but I’d say it’s dipping. PDCA is, I think, the biggest Junior cricket association in Australia and its numbers are a fair bit down on where they were over the decades.
I've been wondering how accurate CAs claims of booming numbers are.
 

NUFAN

Y no Afghanistan flag
I do not see six as being that big. Also, you had overseas players once. Why once and not now? I'm sure there were bigger crowds when the Shield had overseas players during the '70s.
6 is a low number in isolation but 60 players available for Australian selection is quite low.

Life would have been different in the 70s, no real need to compare.
 

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
6 is a low number in isolation but 60 players available for Australian selection is quite low.

Life would have been different in the 70s, no real need to compare.
Is that all it exists for, 'Australian selection'? Are there not fans of the state sides, who like the competition for what it is and not merely as some sort of 'nursery' for the international sides?
 

TheJediBrah

Request Your Custom Title Now!
I was only answering the guys original question mate����
Yeah I was emphatically agreeing with you!

I do not see six as being that big. Also, you had overseas players once. Why once and not now? I'm sure there were bigger crowds when the Shield had overseas players during the '70s.
The requirements for an overseas player to be a good buy in the Shield are higher than in County cricket, given the strength of the competition. Therefore a lot of the overseas players that are automatic selections and dominant in county cricket would be borderline players in the Shield. It's all well and good keeping a young bloke out for someone who is going to be one of your strongest players, but it doesn't make sense to keep out a local for an overseas player who might be, at best, marginally better.

Overseas players in the Shield would need to be real stars IMO for it to work. Someone like Kumar Sangakkara or an English international maybe, but they those players are usually either on international duty or it wouldn't be worth their time. Sangakkara's not going to waste months to play Shield for meagre pay. (Pretty sure there's more money in country cricket too)
 
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