Dale Steyn -Greatest of All Time

[Daemon]

After McGrath and MM, it just becomes too hard.

Personally can't split between Akram, Lillee, Trueman, Steyn, Garner, Davidson and Donald but my bias says top 5.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I rate him as highly as anyone, but just playing devil's advocate, do we hold it against him that he played so much in SA?

People were saying when analysing Graeme Smith's batting average it should be taken into account that he played so much in SA, which is traditionally fast-bowler friendly, especially with the new ball. If that's the case then you'd have to take it into account when rating Steyn as a bowler, just logically speaking.

I don't think it means he isn't an ATG or doesn't belong in the top 5, not by a long shot, but would you have to take it into account when regarding his statistics as people did with Graeme Smith?

By that token bowlers from the SC should get extra points for bowling on unhelpful wickets

they do

maybe not as much as they should though. One thing I've noticed is that people tend to use where a team plays as a way to rate batsmen's averages but they don't seem to do it for bowlers as much.

eg. Australian batsman has high average, "doesn't count as much because he plays on roads". But the same concession isn't given to Australian bowlers very often. (just using Australia as an example for obvious reasons)

Steyn's the most successful overseas pacer ever in the subcontinent

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

 

[smash84]

Yes, it isn't far fetched to rank him alongside those greats

Steyn's the most successful overseas pacer ever in the subcontinent

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

yeah, i have said earlier that i don't think its unreasonable to rank him top 5 of all time.

 

[_00_deathscar]

I've been watching since the early 90s, and in my time, I'd say he's neck and neck with McGrath and Akram, just ahead of Ambrose.

By most accounts Barnes wasnt quick e.g. Bradman rated O'Reilly higher as Barnes didnt have a googly

Impossible to rate Spofforth

Larwood ranks lower on basis of longevity as does Tyson

Many experts rank Lindwall below Lillee whom I rate below McGrath

I seriously doubt that Davidson was as good as Akram

Wow - couple of things from that:
- Courtney Walsh in the subcontinent. Wow
- Kapil Dev's stats in the subcontinent are wretched.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Steyn's the most successful overseas pacer ever in the subcontinent

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

ok?

 

[OverratedSanity]

ok?

Well you said bowling well in the SC should get more credit, so I thought it was a relevant statistic.

 

[smash84]

I've been watching since the early 90s, and in my time, I'd say he's neck and neck with McGrath and Akram, just ahead of Ambrose.



Wow - couple of things from that:
- Courtney Walsh in the subcontinent. Wow
- Kapil Dev's stats in the subcontinent are wretched.

This doesn't take into account the home matches of players

 

[TheJediBrah]

Well you said bowling well in the SC should get more credit, so I thought it was a relevant statistic.

Oh yeah, I was so focused on my overall point that I forgot I said that

 

[Himannv]

Top 20 seems about right.

 

[Chrish]

If Steyn’s place in top 5 SA bowlers is not guaranteed, then SA has the best bowling lineup of all teams by a considerable distance..

 

[Fuller Pilch]

If Steyn’s place in top 5 SA bowlers is not guaranteed, then SA has the best bowling lineup of all teams by a considerable distance..

He wouldn't be guaranteed top 5 for Australia and West Indies either.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Surely he's top 1 for SA

Pollock and Donald were good too I guess

 

[vcs]

I just want him to play 100 Tests and get to 500 wickets.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Would he count as better than Donald and Pollock?

I thought this debate ended years ago. He's achieved way more.

 

[stephen]

Steyn is easily my number 1 SA bowler and honestly he's right up there with the best of the best. He has a faultless record and has done everything including bowling his team to victory against India and Australia away - the two places hardest to tour to.

I don't know what more he has to do. He's been a great player for such a long time and done it everywhere.

 

[S.Kennedy]

'SA' changes things - top three for certain.

 

[Agent TBY]

Someone bump this thread in twenty years' time, when Steyn starts benefiting from that sweet "past players are always better" bonus.

 

[Burgey]

Surely he's top 1 for SA

Pollock and Donald were good too I guess

Agreed. Better than Donald imo and a fair way ahead of Pollock too.

 

[vcs]

I guess the only criticism you could make is that he hasn't completely dominated a series against the best players of pace (Australia/England), the way he's done vs. India and other teams. Saying that, India had a damn good batting lineup in 2010-11 when he routed us in Nagpur and we toured there later that year. That was probably peak Steyn.

 

[SeamUp]

No doubting he is in the best of the best category but what limit is that ? Tough to say if he is SA's - we've had a few but I will say that it would be great for him to come back just to remind us (for those that may have forgot) of his genius before he retires.