Greatest teams of all time.

[S.Kennedy]

Not sure why Broads in your team though, he only played 2 tests in the 10/11 Ashes? Apart from that our teams are not dissimilar and it seems to be a clear win for 2010/11 to me.

He played no less than Bresnan, and Tremlett only played one more test. Well, I'm cheating a bit with Broad and looking outside and beyond that Ashes. He did have that amazing spell at The Oval in '09 so he was already on his way.

So in spite of arguing 2005 is better you make it 6-4 in favour of 2010/11...

I do not think there is any argument against 2010-11 being more consistent across the board, throughout all eleven players, but the question on whether or not it is better is decided in 2005's favour (for me). I suppose one way to look at it is 2005's greats, the bowling quartet above all else not to mention Vaughan's inspired captaincy, compensate for any shortcomings be they wicket-keeping, spin or Bell's batting. Also, and this is just a personal aesthetic preference, but I find Strauss's top order - Cook, Strauss himself and Trott - to be a great incentive to head to the bar. 2005 had Trescothick and, although he didn't have the best series, Vaughan.

One thing the 2010-11 lacked was an all-rounder, least of all a talismanic career defining all-rounder which '05 had in spades in Freddie; the closest to an all-rounder 2010 had was Collingwood who was really a part-timer at test level - he only bowled 31 overs I see all series. I suppose Broad was being talked of as an 'all-rounder' in those days and he played two!

 

[OverratedSanity]

Yeah KP was equally good in both series, but I was at Adelaide Oval when he made that double so he get's my nod for 10/11 for that.

Not sure why Broads in your team though, he only played 2 tests in the 10/11 Ashes? Apart from that our teams are not dissimilar and it seems to be a clear win for 2010/11 to me.

If we're considering 2010-11 as a whole instead of only the ashes,then Broad definitely gets in for what he did to India.

 

[wpdavid]

If we're looking at 2004 to 2005 as a whole versus 2010 to 2012 as a whole, then I'll pick Thorpe alongside KP in the middle order.
Which probably justifies Broad's inclusion even if he missed much of the 2010-11 Ashes.

btw if I can nitpick a bit, the earlier team did't really come together until 2004, as Hoggard and Jones were injured for much/all of 2003.
Their period of excellence as a unit only really lasted for 18 months.

fwiw here's my combined side from the two eras.

1. Strauss (the 2004/05 version)
2. Trescothick
3. Trott
4. KP
5. Thorpe
6. Flintoff
7. Prior
8. Swann
9. Broad
10. Jones
11. Anderson

 

[S.Kennedy]

The sad thing about these line-ups was they probably would have happened. If the likes of Jones, Vaughan, Harmison, Flintoff were not all knackered out of the game, Jimmy and Stuart would have been reaching their peak during the tail end of their careers. Also it doesn't help that Troy Cooley buggered up Anderson's action. Anderson had already played twelve tests before the '05 Ashes and was unlucky to have not made The Oval while Cook and Broad would make their test debuts 2006-07.

But, that is injury and sport.

And that is without mentioning the generally 'Pietersen inspired; politics of that era. Moores etc.

 

[wpdavid]

The sad thing about these line-ups was they probably would have happened. If the likes of Jones, Vaughan, Harmison, Flintoff were not all knackered out of the game, Jimmy and Stuart would have been reaching their peak during the tail end of their careers. Also it doesn't help that Troy Cooley buggered up Anderson's action. Anderson had already played twelve tests before the '05 Ashes and was unlucky to have not made The Oval while Cook and Broad would make their test debuts 2006-07.

But, that is injury and sport.

And that is without mentioning the generally 'Pietersen inspired; politics of that era. Moores etc.

I suspect that your final point had an impact on the 2012 series against SA, wherever blame needs to be apportioned. Certainly comparing that series to the one in SA two and a half years earlier, where we competed much better, even if we were unhealthily reliant of Graham Onions' batting.

 

[Adders]

If we're looking at 2004 to 2005 as a whole versus 2010 to 2012 as a whole, then I'll pick Thorpe alongside KP in the middle order.
Which probably justifies Broad's inclusion even if he missed much of the 2010-11 Ashes.

btw if I can nitpick a bit, the earlier team did't really come together until 2004, as Hoggard and Jones were injured for much/all of 2003.
Their period of excellence as a unit only really lasted for 18 months.

fwiw here's my combined side from the two eras.

1. Strauss (the 2004/05 version)
2. Trescothick
3. Trott
4. KP
5. Thorpe
6. Flintoff
7. Prior
8. Swann
9. Broad
10. Jones
11. Anderson

Surely 2010-2012 Cook gets in??? He was a machine for most of those 3 years!

 

[Red]

So, what about "the greatest teams of all time" instead of "which mediocre England side was not that bad for once"?

 

[Adders]

Don't try to be a Burgey RH......it doesn't suite you

 

[TheJediBrah]

So, what about "the greatest teams of all time" instead of "which mediocre England side was not that bad for once"?

We're all thinking it but too polite to say it

anyway let them have their fun

 

[S.Kennedy]

Worrell's West Indies.