Selfish mother ****ers

[cnerd123]

tbh if I had a bunch of inconsistent batsmen, 1 really good reliable batsman, and a decently strong tail, I'd probably bat the really good batsman somewhere between 4-6. If the top order clicks he walks in on a big platform and kills it. If they fail he can rebuild with the strong tail. If I send him in too early I risk losing him to a good ball from fresh bowlers with the new ball. By holding him back i reduce the odds of an early dismissal. He also gets to see how the pitch is behaving before he walks in to bat, increasing the odds of his success.

There are situations where I would like him in earlier - such as to guide a 4th innings runchase - but I can see how a Shiv or Clarke batting between 4-6 for the teams they were playing in worked.

 

[Red]

Ok I never said otherwise

Well, you pretty much did...

Why though? No way this applies to someone who's top order constantly fails. If you're the best batsman in your team at no. 6, you should be able to be the best batsman in your team at no. 3

 

[Spark]

The main reason Clarke batted 5 was because he seemed to suffer from some sort of voodoo curse **** at 4 for ages, though. Ideally he would have batted 4, and did by the end of his career.

 

[Red]

The main reason Clarke batted 5 was because he seemed to suffer from some sort of voodoo curse **** at 4 for ages, though. Ideally he would have batted 4, and did by the end of his career.

Yeh was weird. Looked like a classical #4

 

[TheJediBrah]

Well, you pretty much did...

Nah that's pretty different

 

[Kirkut]

I struggle to understand why little bit of selfishness in sports is seen negatively, all competitive sports players are selfish.

Some philosophy here - Complete selflessness is not possible, if someone appears to be selfless then there is a selfish motive behind it.

 

[NUFAN]

You want a fun cricket conspiracy?

Footage and highlights of almost all the games in that tournament can be found online. Except for one game, where you can only find footage of the first innings but not the second.

Take a wild guess which game that is

New Zealand vs East Africa?

 

[Dendarii]

I can accept it for the ODI`s possibly... but he had a similar role early career for keeping the innings together even in ODI`s, we had many big hitters but few consistent batsmen. Still don`t think he was a selfish player in anyway.

I freely admit to possibly being biased, being a massive Kallis fan, but I don't think he was selfish either. I'd agree with him being slow, but as you've pointed out, that was often out of needing to anchor the innings. Yes, his scoring rate did mean that there were times when someone like Klusener would be needed to come in and score at 7+ an over to win, but if he hadn't batted the way he did then South Africa might not have even been able to get to that position in the first place.

 

[bagapath]

Stewart was the biggest **** of all. wanted to keep his average above 40 and made the tailenders face the music in his last few innings. fate had other plans for him and he ended up with 39 point something.

 

[Howe_zat]

When Shiv debuted he played alongside Lara, Haynes, Richardson, Ambrose and Walsh. When he finished he played alongside Shai Hope, Jason Holder and Veerasammy Permaul with Ramdin as captain

over the years that process would make anyone look out for number one i'd imagine

 

[burr]

Has to be the best (worst) example

I don't think there has there ever been an incidental comparable to that one in Christchurch when he was England captain and batting so slowly when we needed quick runs that his vice-captain (Bob Willis) sent Ian Botham out with instructions to run him out

Yes, one of my favourite cricket stories. What an odious man.

 

[S.Kennedy]

The stories of Boycott are legendary. His partner took an eternity to read a spin bowler's deliveries; upon finally learning the key and mentioning it to Geoffrey in the middle, Geoff replied, ''oh, I figured him out ages ago''. Running out partners was pretty much routine for Boycott. In his defense he carried the Tyke batting through a tumultuous time in Yorkshire cricket when Yorkshire were left behind the other clubs who were recruiting from overseas through their ''Yorkshire born'' policy.

 

[akilana]

Dunno, everyone's just saying it so I went along with it

I guess it's just because he's slow, which hasn't really been in issue in Tests except possibly costing SA time to bowl out opposition, but there are times in ODIs where his batting has cost the team

Dravid was slower than Kallis but you will never find somebody accusing him of selfishness. He is championed as the ultimate team player.

 

[DriveClub]

Swann for jumping ship halfway through the storm to protect his average

 

[jimmy101]

Swann for jumping ship halfway through the storm to protect his average

Good call

 

[OverratedSanity]

Dravid was slower than Kallis but you will never find somebody accusing him of selfishness. He is championed as the ultimate team player.

Different though. At times it seemed that Dravid went out of his way to be a team man. Opening the batting whenever one of the openers was injured/dropped, handling the workload of being a keeper in ODIs in the WC, etc.

Do agree with you though. Kallis wasn't selfish at all. Just gets hate because he bats slow. Don't remember any innings of his that I'd classify as selfish. People in general are just stupid and find reasons to hate slow scoring batsmen.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Swann for jumping ship halfway through the storm to protect his average

Good call

His elbow was gone wasn't it?

I think he left the squad too though didn't he, which was kinda ****.

 

[StephenZA]

Different though. At times it seemed that Dravid went out of his way to be a team man. Opening the batting whenever one of the openers was injured/dropped, handling the workload of being a keeper in ODIs in the WC, etc.

Do agree with you though. Kallis wasn't selfish at all. Just gets hate because he bats slow. Don't remember any innings of his that I'd classify as selfish. People in general are just stupid and find reasons to hate slow scoring batsmen.

Details but Kallis was an all rounder that particularly in his earlier career also had to bowl 15+ overs... but we are all happy that Kallis was not selfish.

 

[Burner]

I'll confess, it is grating to see batsmen play in the same way that they did for the past 100 balls when the situation requires the lifting of the tempo. Some batsmen maybe don't have that higher gear and I guess might be the reason they get termed 'selfish'.

 

[indiaholic]

In test matches, the situations where you actually 'need' to raise the tempo are a bit rare.