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South Africa team selection

StephenZA

Hall of Fame Member
I dunno when the test players arrive in New Zealand, but if South Africa win the next ODI, maybe have the idea of Morkel replacing Rabada for the fifth ODI - get some overs under the belt
He is not part of the ODI squad so unless there is injury normally won`t be "allowed" to play by CSA.... (stand to correction on this!)
 

CapeTown Guy

School Boy/Girl Captain
I dont mind Morkel in the squad, if he is fully fit then he is a bit different to anything else we have. He is obviously short of a gallop, though, but perhaps he is a good guy to have around the squad for what is a relatively inexperienced bowling attack.

A county deal with the view of genuinely challenging for a spot in the side by the end of the year might be a better solution for everyone. In essense, Rabada has basically taken his place, so not sure how realistic a return to the Test side really is.
 

Dendarii

International Debutant
In essense, Rabada has basically taken his place, so not sure how realistic a return to the Test side really is.
That would be the case if Steyn were fit, but with him out you'd think that Morkel would be the first choice for the third seamer spot ahead of Olivier/Parnell/Morris.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
I guess SA management need to communicate well with Steyn (34) & Morkel (33) moving forward. Obviously quota limitations will restrict their time possibly in ODI & Test cricket respectively (for example fighting for one position in test team) but their fitness/age could help balance those issues out. CSA need to tell them what they expect from them moving forward to keep them content.

Both will be available for England but how much cricket will they have had ? I hope they get county deals and don't play for the SA 'A' team because the next batch need those sorts of games more than them for experience. The SA 'A' tour co-incides with the ODI tour to England and Champions Trophy so no players involved there will be in the SA 'A' squad.
 

CapeTown Guy

School Boy/Girl Captain
That would be the case if Steyn were fit, but with him out you'd think that Morkel would be the first choice for the third seamer spot ahead of Olivier/Parnell/Morris.
Olivier will play ahead of Morkel, I'm pretty sure.

I see it like this - Olivier is Steyn's back-up (it was Abbott previously), Morkel/Rabada are vying for one spot, and Philander/Morris/Parnell compete for one position unless we go the extra bowler route I mentioned above.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
Been going on for some time and was clearly going to happen. A few players have gone this route like Daryn Smit (but he just isn't getting a County deal straight away). Another example is Graeme van Buuren at Gloucestershire.

With Duanne Olivier being picked. They already going to that next generation of younger bowlers. Guys like Rabian Englebrecht , Calvin Savage, Lizaad Williams and Corne Dry were with him at u19 level so lets see who is next with the younger bowlers like Rabada, Olivier and Ngidi (who had a day to forget in his first game back from injury).

An obvious flaw is whether a guy like Dane Paterson is better than Marchant de Lange and Hardus Viljoen which is obviously debatable.
 
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StephenZA

Hall of Fame Member
An obvious flaw is whether a guy like Dane Paterson is better than Marchant de Lange and Hardus Viljoen which is obviously debatable.
You wonder how much that was because de Lange and Viljoen were already known to be outta of here though....

But CSA do appear to be going to the younger guys, looking longer term.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
You wonder how much that was because de Lange and Viljoen were already known to be outta of here though....

But CSA do appear to be going to the younger guys, looking longer term.
Fair point.

I see Cook, Morris, Maharaj, Shamsi and Phehlukwayo were given central contracts the other day with only Rossouw and Abbott falling out.

de Kock and Rabada have moved to 'A' grade contracts that only Hash, JP, Faf, AB, Vern , Dale and Morne were previously on.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
How bad would this series have to go to at least bring in Theunis de Bruyn to the top 6?
 

SeamUp

International Coach
With Rossouw/van Zyl gone Kolpak and AB on self-imposed break. Plus Sunfoil series leading run-scorer Colin Ackermann not available according to a report I read I am struggling to think who else besides de Bruyn who is on tour is ready now for test cricket. Maybe Heino Kuhn.
 

StephenZA

Hall of Fame Member
deBruyn must come in for Duminy now (ideally 2nd innings of this test) :p . ... suppose I should wait for Bavuma to bat, but I`m just so sick of Duminy.

Zonda is the only other player right now that is showing some form and ability... other player I`ve always rated but has probably missed the boat is Ingram. Miller has also shown good form in the sunfoil and we cold just bite the bullet and bring Markram in early.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
deBruyn must come in for Duminy now (ideally 2nd innings of this test) :p . ... suppose I should wait for Bavuma to bat, but I`m just so sick of Duminy.

Zonda is the only other player right now that is showing some form and ability... other player I`ve always rated but has probably missed the boat is Ingram. Miller has also shown good form in the sunfoil and we cold just bite the bullet and bring Markram in early.
I wonder when they feel they need to make that change. A disappointing run of performances or a test loss or a series loss?

I think Kuhn, Zondo etc will be in the A side v England but if you put Kuhn in a test team tomorrow I would back him to score a hundred.

It just feels weird to be.in this limited situation because we had built up quite a queue before the Kolpaks. So time for that next generation like Markram to gain more experiences with the SA A team as soon as possible.
 

StephenZA

Hall of Fame Member
Interesting to see how the 'A' side performs, and selection thereof.

Kuhn could probably step up to the highest level quickly... but it would feel very much like a stop gap if he came in, just waiting for the next gen. It is unfortunate that we lost Rillee in particular, but we are talking about only 1 or 2 positions really available in the team and few guarantees for the incoming batsmen, with real loyalty shown in the test team for the incumbents (probably to much). And there is always a chance deVillers is back in 9 months??
 

SeamUp

International Coach
Interesting to see how the 'A' side performs, and selection thereof.

Kuhn could probably step up to the highest level quickly... but it would feel very much like a stop gap if he came in, just waiting for the next gen. It is unfortunate that we lost Rillee in particular, but we are talking about only 1 or 2 positions really available in the team and few guarantees for the incoming batsmen, with real loyalty shown in the test team for the incumbents (probably to much). And there is always a chance deVillers is back in 9 months??
Suppose we forced to pick the best now due to limited 25+ options. From watching the Momentum Cup both Kuhn and Zondo look in good touch.

Would love AB back but it seems he says he only has 8 test matches left in him. Hinting at home 8 tests v India and Australia being his last if he gets the chance.
 

akilana

International 12th Man
With Rossouw/van Zyl gone Kolpak and AB on self-imposed break. Plus Sunfoil series leading run-scorer Colin Ackermann not available according to a report I read I am struggling to think who else besides de Bruyn who is on tour is ready now for test cricket. Maybe Heino Kuhn.
I always kept an eye on ackerman since his u19 days after reading your posts about him. Is he any good? I think I read somewhere that he has a dutch passport and looking elsewhere.

There are 3 spots under scrutiny. Amla, JP and Temba. Losing Russow didnt help but I believe the next two would be De Bruyn and Zonda.
 

Dendarii

International Debutant
There are 3 spots under scrutiny. Amla, JP and Temba.
I suspect that none of those three will be going anywhere any time soon.

I don't see Amla being dropped. He's built up enough credit over his career that I'd be surprised if he wasn't allowed to go out on his terms.

Duminy hasn't had a great run in the shorter format, but he's done pretty well since his recall to the test team, and he does have a decent record in England (admittedly only based on three matches). So I think they will keep him for that series at least, although I suppose that it could depend on how this series goes.

And even if political considerations didn't make dropping Bavuma a little tricky, he's already scored more runs in this innings than he did in the entire series against Sri Lanka, so he's probably earned himself a reprieve for now. Although again it could depend on how he plays throughout this series.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
I always kept an eye on ackerman since his u19 days after reading your posts about him. Is he any good? I think I read somewhere that he has a dutch passport and looking elsewhere.

There are 3 spots under scrutiny. Amla, JP and Temba. Losing Russow didnt help but I believe the next two would be De Bruyn and Zonda.
Only really got his chance two to three seasons ago and last season the signs were there in his 4-day game he belongs at franchise level. But this season he has certainly put a season together to make selectors sit up and if available would no doubt earn A selection.

I used to look at him as 4-day player only. Possibly a bit of an accumulator and one paced but 2 recent knocks of his in Momentum cup shows me has power and can change gear.

Also bowls lovely off-spin and good fielder. Could bring what our current number 4 is penciled in to bring.
 

SeamUp

International Coach
I suspect that none of those three will be going anywhere any time soon.

I don't see Amla being dropped. He's built up enough credit over his career that I'd be surprised if he wasn't allowed to go out on his terms.

Duminy hasn't had a great run in the shorter format, but he's done pretty well since his recall to the test team, and he does have a decent record in England (admittedly only based on three matches). So I think they will keep him for that series at least, although I suppose that it could depend on how this series goes.

And even if political considerations didn't make dropping Bavuma a little tricky, he's already scored more runs in this innings than he did in the entire series against Sri Lanka, so he's probably earned himself a reprieve for now. Although again it could depend on how he plays throughout this series.
I agree on Amla but contingency plans need to be put in place.

I think they happy if Bavuma averages low to mid 30s.

I reckon Jp's position will be under huge pressure and may lose it in England.

They just gave Cook a contract and he deserves but he will be a stop-gap only. Reckon they will want to find a younger replacement in next 12-18 months.
 

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