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CW chooses the 2 best bowlers ever: 60 spinners + 100 pacemen in 2 separate contests

mr_mister

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Okay, another one similar to the batting one. However I'll be running 2 different contests simultaneously coz quickies and spinners are hard to compare


We're going with what cricinfo defines them as to settle issues over whether O'Reilly was really a medium pace bowler or Barnes was really a spinner. We're also going with what they had more success with if they bowled more than one style


Also these are definitely subject to change, if you want someone subbed out, first say who you want to swap with and give a compelling argument. I've chosen nominees based on their exploits in in either tests, ODIs or in some cases just FC when their test careers were stunted but they still had a reputation as terrific bowlers


I've also split players into countries rather than eras to mix things up, and for err... bowling minnows who didn't either produce many quickies(eg India) or spinners(eg Windies/SA) I'm lumped them together to make somewhat equal groups. Half the players from each heat will advance to Round 2, so every group is an even number for round 1. from there i'll decide the Round 2 rules lol

The groups are of uneven size, but whatever, start scouring them gents





Spinners:



Australia (12 players)


Hugh Trumble
Jack Saunders
Arthur Mailey
Clarrie Grimmett
Bert Ironmonger
Bill O'Reilly
Chuck Fleetwood-Smith
Jack Iverson
Richie Benaud
Ashley Mallett
Shane Warne
Stuart MacGill



India (14 players)

Vinoo Mankad
Subhash Gupte
Bapu Nadkarni
Bishen Bedi
Erapalli Prasanna
Bhagwat Chandrasekhar
Srinivas Venkataraghavan
Dilip Doshi
Narenda Hirwani
Ravi Shastri
Anil Kumble
Harbhajan Singh
Ravi Ashwin
Ravi Jadeja






Others (NZ, Pakistan, SL, SA and West Indies 18 players)

Aubrey Faulkner
Hugh Tayfield
Bert Vogler
Dan Vettori
Iqbal Qasim
Abdul Qadir
Mustaq Ahmed
Saqlain Mustaq
Shahid Afridi
Danish Kaneria
Saeed Ajmal
Yasir Shah
Muttiah Muralitharan
Sanath Jayasuriya
Rangana Herath
Sonny Ramadin
Alf Valentine
Lance Gibbs

England (20 players)

Billy Bates
Bobby Peel
Johnny Briggs
Colin Blythe
Bernard Bosanquet
Wilfred Rhodes
Tich Freeman
Headley Verity
Roy Tattersall
Jim Laker
Tony Lock
Fred Titmus
Bob Appleyard
Johnny Wardle
Derek Underwood
Ray Illingworth
John Embury
Phil Tufnell
Monty Panesar
Graeme Swann


Pacemen:


South Africa (16 players)

Peter Pollock
Peter Heine
Neil Adcock
Trevor Goddard
Garth Le Roux
Vincent Van Der Bijl
Mike Procter
Fanie De Villiers
Craig Matthews
Alan Donald
Shaun Pollock
Jacques Kallis
Mahkaya Ntini
Dale Steyn
Vernon Philander
Morne Morkel


West Indies (16 players)

Learie Constantine
Manny Martindale
Wes Hall
Roy Gilchrist
Charlie Griffith
Gerry Gomez
Andy Roberts
Malcolm Marshall
Joel Garner
Michael Holding
Colin Croft
Sylvester Clarke
Curtley Ambrose
Courtney Walsh
Ian Bishop
Winston Benjamin


Others (Pakistan, SL, NZ, Zim, India, 24 players)


Fazal Mahmood
Imran Khan
Safraz Nawaz
Wasim Akram
Waqar Younis
Shoaib Akthar
Mohammad Asif
Mohammad Amir
Jack Cowie
Richard Hadlee
Shane Bond
Chris Cairns
Chris Harris
Gavin Larsen
Tim Southee
Trent Boult
Heath Streak
Chaminda Vaas
Lasith Malinga
Mohammad Nissar
Amar Singh
Kapil Dev
Javagal Srinath
Zaheer Khan


England (30 players)

George Lohmann
Tom Richardson
George Ulyett
Sydney Barnes
Frank Foster
Maurice Tate
Harold Larwood
Bill Voce
Bill Bowes
Ken Farnes
Alec Bedser
Frank Tyson
Fred Trueman
Brian Statham
Ken Higgs
John Snow
John Lever
Mike Hendrick
Bob Willis
Ian Botham
Tony Greig
Angus Fraser
Darren Gough
Dean Headley
Andy Caddick
Matthew Hoggard
Steve Harmison
Andrew Flintoff
Jimmy Anderson
Stuart Broad


Australia (30 players)


JJ Ferris
Charlie Turner
Fred Spofforth
Monty Noble
Tibby Cotter
Ernie Jones
Ted McDonald
Jack Gregory
Eddie Gilbert
Keith Miller
Ray Lindwall
Alan Davidson
Bill Johnston
Dennis Lillee
Jeff Thomson
Rodney Hogg
Graham McKenzie
Max Walker
Terry Alderman
Bruce Reid
Merv Hughes
Craig McDermott
Glen McGrath
Paul Reiffel
Jason Gillespie
Damian Fleming
Brett Lee
Ryan Harris
Mitchell Johnson
Mitchell Starc
 
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viriya

International Captain
Why is it called second best bowlers? Is it because the end result is a pacer and a spinner?
 

the big bambino

International Captain
Well they are comprehensive lists mr_m and I don't want to seem picky but I cant see Eddie Gilbert making the cut, even though I like him. I'd replace him with Ernie McCormick (if you re looking for someone of the same era) or better still Geoff Lawson or Ernie Jones. Would probably go with Jones meself.

Edit: Include Garth McKenzie as well.
 
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watson

Banned
Including Jones is a good idea.

Of all the fast bowlers the Australians have sent to this country, I think Jones was the best in my time. I have very good reasons for remembering him, as I took part in the first match he played in this country against Lord Sheffield's XI at Sheffield Park, Sussex, in 1896.......

The ball was bouncing, and only Ranji appeared to like it. The pace that Jones was bowling impressed me because in the second innings, when I had made about 10, I had the misfortune to stop one with my ribs, but with the assistance of W. A. J. West, the umpire, who rubbed me, I was able to continue my innings.

When I went to London I had a good deal of pain, and my father sent for the doctor, who said, "It's cracked horizontally." He strapped me up, and I did not play for three weeks. Within a month of Sheffield Park I faced Jones at Lord's in the M.C.C. match, and he came up to me and said, "I am terribly sorry", and he clasped my hand in a vice-like grip that left me wondering which was the more painful--my hand or broken ribs.

Following those early incidents, Harry Trott took Jones in charge and changed him into a very fine bowler. He made him shorten his run and taught him the value of length and control. Jones developed a beautiful action.

- STANLEY JACKSON
 

mr_mister

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
yeah Jones seem like a great choice. My knowledge of Golden Age cricket still a teeny bit lacking. Must admit I think Gilbert just has an awesome story and the fact he got Bradman out with apparent ease adds to his mystique


But happy to sub Jones in for him
 

OverratedSanity

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Don't make this test only, please.

Edit: Oh I see it's not. Good. Regardless, don't change your mind halfway through like you did last time.
 
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mr_mister

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Don't make this test only, please.

it's not, I put in Malinga for example, as well as Van Der Bijl and Le Roux


but you've made me think should Umar Gul go in? isn't he some kind of t20 specialist


and maybe Chris Harris for his pioneering economic limited overs stuff?
 
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mr_mister

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
but for those like Grimmett and stuff we have to make guesses how well they would have gone at limited overs bowling
 

Daemon

Request Your Custom Title Now!
I don't see how it's possible for anyone besides Murali to win the spinners spot
 

viriya

International Captain
but for those like Grimmett and stuff we have to make guesses how well they would have gone at limited overs bowling
This is why I think combining Test and ODIs is a mistake. Some people will just rate based on Test performances (because ODI is hit-and-giggle comparatively), and others will discount pre-ODI players just based on not playing one format.

Rather just have Test only but your call.
 

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