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Thread: Why Isn't Mark Butcher in the ODI side?

  1. #16
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Well, he still possesses it, but often doesnt care! He gets carried away when he is in good form, and depite often knowing (or I think he does) know the ball is way outside off, he still plays at it.

    Still a good player when he feels like having a big innings. It really does seem like sometimes he goes out there in a test to get 50......
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  2. #17
    World Traveller Craig's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Mr Mxyzptlk
    In the last year or two he has been far more selective outside offstump and more willing to exercise the leave-alone. As such he has reaped the benefits of flying up the ODI rankings.

    I haven't seen Trescothick bat in a while, but from what I've heard his lack of foot movement is really getting to be troublesome. Gayle is still pretty leadfooted but, as stated above, his shot selection has helped diminish the exposing of this flaw. When Trescothick debuted I distinctly remember that he had rather superb judgement on and outside offstump. It frustrated the hell out of the West Indian bowlers. Has he given this up or is it still part of his game?
    When balls are pitched wide outside off stump, he plays a defensive shot to a ball that he isnt going to hit, to make sure he wont go and play some crazy shot.
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  3. #18
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Craig
    When balls are pitched wide outside off stump, he plays a defensive shot to a ball that he isnt going to hit, to make sure he wont go and play some crazy shot.
    That's playing inside the line. That's how I remember Trescothick to be. Wavell Hinds has been like that lately too, but the first person I saw exercise that often was Adrian Griffith.
    Sreesanth said, "Next ball he was beaten and I said, 'is this the King Charles Lara? Who is this impostor, moving around nervously? I should have kept my mouth shut for the next ball - mind you, it was a length ball - Lara just pulled it over the church beyond the boundary! He is a true legend."

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  4. #19
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Mr Mxyzptlk
    Hmmm... Chris Gayle doesn't have the greatest technique, but he continues to score impressively.
    Very impressively - he's number 1 at the moment!
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  5. #20
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Mr Mxyzptlk
    That's playing inside the line. That's how I remember Trescothick to be. Wavell Hinds has been like that lately too, but the first person I saw exercise that often was Adrian Griffith.
    Weird, that's exactly the same as me.
    The first time I ever saw that leave was when Griffith came into the side at Lord's in 2000. I saw it again from another player just one Test later. Then that winter it became very clear that Hinds had practised it, he played it loads when he was recalled at The WACA.
    Trescothick will always play that leave, it worked very well against Ambrose and Walsh, but his first-chance scores in that series nonetheless read: 3, 38*, 1, 7, 7. The catching should have frustrated the bowlers more than Trescothick's leave.
    Trescothick often gets into trouble, as well as hitting in the air all the time, with not knowing whether to play that leave or actually try to hit the ball. Gillespie has been the best exponent of exploiting that flaw, I can think of at least 7 occasions when he's got it (even if not all the chances have been taken).
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  6. #21
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Prince EWS
    Well, he still possesses it, but often doesnt care! He gets carried away when he is in good form, and depite often knowing (or I think he does) know the ball is way outside off, he still plays at it.

    Still a good player when he feels like having a big innings. It really does seem like sometimes he goes out there in a test to get 50......
    He's never made many 50s without being let-off first.

  7. #22
    State Vice-Captain Armadillo's Avatar
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    Originally posted by marc71178
    Very impressively - he's number 1 at the moment!
    Chris Gayle's no. 1?.I think people are starting to doubt PwC 's system, I am.
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  8. #23
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Tom Halsey
    Well, maybe he has improved?

    Just a suggestion.
    Maybe he has.
    Normally takes more than one season to demonstrate that, though.

  9. #24
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Armadillo
    If thy've never tried butcher in OD then they might as well, what is to stop him playing really well
    They've never tried Steve Stubbings or Mark Chilton in ODIs, they might as well, what is to stop them playing really well?
    The fact that their domestic averages are poor is the answer. And in Butcher's case too. Despite the fact that all three could be better at domestic level than their averages suggest.

  10. #25
    State Vice-Captain Armadillo's Avatar
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    Has Steve Stubbings played a test match?

  11. #26
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Richard
    They've never tried Steve Stubbings or Mark Chilton in ODIs, they might as well, what is to stop them playing really well?
    Nothing, but seeing as Butcher has already shown he can cope with International Cricket, that gives him a boost.

  12. #27
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Armadillo
    Chris Gayle's no. 1?.I think people are starting to doubt PwC 's system, I am.
    Why? Chris Gayle doesn't deserve to be number 1?

    He's scored 1969 runs in his last 40 ODIs at 53.21 per innings with 7 hundreds and 10 fifties against various different opponents, including Australia, South Africa, New Zealand and India. In that time he's been dismissed only twice without scoring and has 3 scores over 140, two of which were 150+ unbeaten.

    In his last 40 innings that he's crossed 10 he's gone on to score at an average of 66.32.

    Added to all this, in this time he's taken 41 wickets at 29.78 with 2x4w and 1x5w and a best haul of 5/46 against Australia. His economy rate has been 4.79 and his SR 37.2.

    Give the man some credit!

  13. #28
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by marc71178
    Nothing, but seeing as Butcher has already shown he can cope with International Cricket, that gives him a boost.
    No, he's shown he can cope with Test-cricket - as his First-Class average suggests he should be able to.

  14. #29
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Armadillo
    Has Steve Stubbings played a test match?
    No, never got anywhere near.
    Never been consistent in First-Class cricket, though he has had his moments.
    IMO he's been unlucky to play as little as he has in the last couple of years in the Championship. He had a near-fairytale end to last season, and hopefully will start this season at the top of the Championship order and in the middle in the League.

  15. #30
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Richard
    No, he's shown he can cope with Test-cricket - as his First-Class average suggests he should be able to.
    Well excuse me, but last time I checked Test Cricket is International Cricket.

    And Cricket at that level requires mental strengths as well as talent - Butcher has shown he has that by playing Tests for so long, or are you going to deny that and say it's all based on FC average?

    And Butcher's sub-40 First Class average doesn't suggets to me that he should be able to cope with Test Cricket.
    Last edited by marc71178; 06-03-2004 at 03:47 PM.

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