West Indies

[Tim]

This thread was certainly not intended to start a flame war, but NZ's recent ease of which they have handled South Africa must raise questions as to the standard of cricket the West Indies are currently playing.

Liam, I didn't see any of the West Indies tour to South Africa..but the general view was that South Africa well & truly cleaned that series up, yet over in NZ there are still high scoring matches yet South Africa have well & truly been outplayed in 3 of the 4 matches so far.
At home of course, the West Indies will be alot tougher. But their away form must be of a big concern.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Big surprise - the West Indies suck abroad.

When last have we done anything overseas to suggest that we don't? Rhetorical question.

Basically New Zealand has bowling and fielding and West Indies didn't/doesn't. Also, the pitches in New Zealand are different, but it's mostly due to bowling and fielding.

 

[Tim]

True the pitches are different..but the last 3 pitches played on have probably been 270+ wickets and there are enough experienced & quality players in that South African batting lineup to know what is required.

I think the West Indies will get it right against England though, they should win the ODI series at least anyway.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I think the West Indies would do very poorly to lose the Tests to England, because we've beaten better visiting teams with a worse West Indies team before.

 

[Tim]

I think the key to beating England will be to get Vaughan & Trescothick out quickly & to demoralise Flintoff so that he's out of form early in the series.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

The key to winning the series IMO is neutralizing the likes of Thorpe and featuring the likes of Lara. I'm most concerned about Thorpe, because IMO he's definitely the best England batsman. Vaughan is good, but I'm not sold yet. I liked him much more as a player before he became captain.

Flintoff will be an interesting one...

 

[Tim]

Flintoff is the one who is going to be able to hit the fast runs for England..I think if the West Indies can get a check on him then they should be able to control things.

 

[mikka_a]

windies r completely dependent on brian's consistency which is the problem. They also need someone like walsh in their team.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Lara holds the key for me.

If he averages less than 30, we'll win the series, above 70, the WI will.

 

[Langeveldt]

The west indies were diabolical in the SA series...
South Africa were good, except for Kallis and Nel who were outstanding...

Im not sure what to make of this recent blip in New Zealand.. But I can safely say the WI performance in Southern Africa was below par for the international game...

 

[marc71178]

This thread was certainly not intended to start a flame war, but NZ's recent ease of which they have handled South Africa must raise questions as to the standard of cricket the West Indies are currently playing.

But if I remember rightly, didn't the West Indies do well in the ODI's - I think it was 3-1 SA, and should really have been 2-2.

That's not to say NZ won't perform well in the Tests as well, but I think you at least have to compare like with like.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

The west indies were diabolical in the SA series...
South Africa were good, except for Kallis and Nel who were outstanding...

*Cough* Ntini *cough*

South Africa wasn't just good in the recent series, they were outstanding. Only Kallis was very far ahead of the rest.

 

[Swervy]

I think the West Indies would do very poorly to lose the Tests to England, because we've beaten better visiting teams with a worse West Indies team before.

i think both teams would be very dissapointed to lose this series,because i think each team has a valid arguement to be considered favourite

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

windies r completely dependent on brian's consistency which is the problem. They also need someone like walsh in their team.

Chanderpaul, Sarwan and Gayle have come on hugely of late though.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

i think both teams would be very dissapointed to lose this series,because i think each team has a valid arguement to be considered favourite

I think the teams are pretty even, but the West Indies have the home field advantage, which is probably the most notable such advantage for any team other than India.

I say this not in terms of results per se, but the change in the play of the West Indies when at home.

 

[Craig]

Walsh asked to help

Finally some common sense.

 

[Richard]

i think both teams would be very dissapointed to lose this series,because i think each team has a valid arguement to be considered favourite

You mean neither does?
You can't have more than one favourite in a two-horse race; you can have less than one.

 

[Richard]

Re: Re: West Indies

But if I remember rightly, didn't the West Indies do well in the ODI's - I think it was 3-1 SA, and should really have been 2-2.

No such thing as "should" in terms of a result.
It could have been 5-0 to West Indies - if they played better. They could even have won at Kingsmead before the rain came.
IMO South Africa "should" have won 4-0, because it took a very poor bowling performance to lose the Centurion game.

 

[garage flower]

The point is that the 1-day series was - on the whole - fairly evenly contested, certainly relative to the test series. It should also be noted that West Indies were missing Hinds and Samuels, both key batting all-rounders in the 1-day side.

 

[garage flower]

Lara holds the key for me.

If he averages less than 30, we'll win the series, above 70, the WI will.

I disagree. The Windies beat India in the Caribbean 2 years ago with Lara badly out of form (he was coming back from the injury he picked up in Sri Lanka).

The batting should be fine, though I'm sure it'll have its moments (i.e. the odd horrific collapse). The real key/problem is the bowling. The Windies need to find 4 fit bowlers, who can provide consistency/control as well as a measure of penetration. The fielding also needs to improve 100% on the South Africa series.

I would agree that Lara is key to the extent that, if he hits top form, he could dominate what looks to be a fairly ordinary England attack. As we all know though, batsmen don't win test series.