CW decides another one, the greatest All-Rounder ever. 32 players, Nomination thread!

[Howe_zat]

Anyway even if he isn't one of the best allrounders of all time he is certainly one of the most interesting and belongs in the conversation as a result

 

[The Sean]

even at Test level his stats are pretty decent, but yeah FC is included in the voting so it makes sense. Also I love the ol timey players, their cricinfo pages are always a good read. Whats the Rhodes Paradox?

Howe has explained it pretty well, insofar as his achievements as a batsman and bowler over the course of his career were generally separate. Rhodes took 66 wickets at 17 from his first 13 Tests, while being a tail-end batsman. He decided to achieve his goal of "going in first for England" and to his huge credit he worked his way up the order to become a fine Test batsman and formed a productive partnership with Jack Hobbs. As he did so, his bowling took a back seat. Having taken 66 wickets in his first 13 Tests, he took just 61 in his remaining 45, at an average of 37. During his most productive period as Test batsman - a 14 Test run in which he averaged over 50 - he took only four wickets (also averaging over 50!) and hardly bowled. His bowling average declined, but not by far enough to blow out, while his batting average rose steadily to match and overtake it. The end result is that grand old Wilfred finished with the overall record of an outstanding Test all rounder, yet at virtually no point in his Test career was he a genuine force with both bat and ball at the same time. The Rhodes Paradox.

Anyway even if he isn't one of the best allrounders of all time he is certainly one of the most interesting and belongs in the conversation as a result

Completely agree with this, and noting the paradox isn't to denigrate his overall achievements as a cricketer. He had an extraordinary career.

 

[CricAddict]

Steve Waugh is a little similar too. Took a lot of wickets in ODIs before he gave up bowling.

 

[mr_mister]

yeah Steve says in his biography his bowling kept him in the team throughout the 80s

 

[watson]

Anyway even if he isn't one of the best allrounders of all time he is certainly one of the most interesting and belongs in the conversation as a result

Wilfred Rhodes opened the innings for England from 9th August 1909 to 25th Feb 1921. His stats for that period are;

Tests = 27
Runs = 1593
Batting Average = 36.20
100s = 2
HS = 179

Wickets = 15
Wickets per Test = 0.56
Bowling Average = 52.46
BBI = 3 for 33
5w = 0

The stats show that when Rhodes decided to become a frontline batsman he more-or-less gave up his left-arm spin and averaged only half-a-wicket per Test. During the 1911/12 Ashes tour to Australia he had his best series with the bat and averaged 57.87. However his wicket tally was exactly zero.

Rhodes was at his peak as a bowler from 1899 to about 1909 when he batted exclusively in lower half of the batting order. His stats for this period are;

Tests = 25
Runs = 610
Batting Average = 22.59
100s = 0
HS = 69

Wickets = 94
Wickets per Test = 3.8
Bowling Average = 22.05
BBI = 8 for 68
5w = 6

His very best period as a bowler was between 1902 and 1904;

1902 Ashes: 22 wickets at 15.27
1903/04 Ashes: 31 wickets at 15.74

However, in these two series he batting mostly at No.11 and made only a handful of runs.

Therefore, it's difficult to view Rhodes as a great allrounder in the same sense as Faulkner or Benaud because his batting and bowling never peaked together. Rather, Rhodes was;

1. A great bowler who was a typical tail ender (1899 to 1904)
2. A good top order batsman (1909 to 1914)
3. A good bowler who happened to be a handy lower order batsman (1905 to 1908, 1921 to 1930)

 

[mr_mister]

well, 24 more hours are up. time for another batch of noms lol. im just gonna give all the guys who only need 1-2 more noms a go, plus Steve Waugh!



Qualified:

Imran
Hadlee
Sobers
Botham
Miller
Kallis
Procter
Mankad
Flintoff
Grace
Kapil
Rhodes(after my nom)
S Pollock (after my nom)
Chris Cairns (after my nom)
Dan Vettori (after my nom)
Klusener (after my nom)


16 down, 16 to go


my noms:

Rhodes
Pollock
Cairns
Vettori
Klusener

^who now all have 5


Wasim Akram
Heath Streak
Chaminda Vaas
Wally Hammond
Steve Waugh

 

[Lillian Thomson]

I don't know if Tony Greig has been mentioned yet but he's certainly a better allrounder than some in the list and should be in there if it's stretching out to 32 candidates.

 

[fredfertang]

I don't know if Tony Greig has been mentioned yet but he's certainly a better allrounder than some in the list and should be in there if it's stretching out to 32 candidates.

I agree

 

[Red]

Sobers
Miller
Greig
Botham
Gregory
Faulkner
Kallis

Kapil
Imran
Hadlee
S.Pollock
T.Bailey
Benaud
Davidson

 

[The Sean]

I don't know if Tony Greig has been mentioned yet but he's certainly a better allrounder than some in the list and should be in there if it's stretching out to 32 candidates.

I nominated him. Greig - along with Faulkner and Noble - are all ahead of a lot of the blokes already through IMO.

 

[NUFAN]

Shakib Al Hasan
Aubrey Faulkner
Charles Kelleway
Ravi Ashwin (can bat)
Tony Greig
Mushtaq Mohammad
Frank Woolley
Monty Noble

 

[Lillian Thomson]

I nominated him. Greig - along with Faulkner and Noble - are all ahead of a lot of the blokes already through IMO.

Okay, apologies. I admit I was too lazy to read all the nominations.

 

[ankitj]

Nominate Trevor Goddard

 

[OverratedSanity]

Yep get Goddard in there

 

[kyear2]

Hammond
Greig
Goddard
EddieBarlow
Bruce Mitchell
Greg Chappell

All could bay, bowl and brilliant at slip.

 

[watson]

Carl Hooper
Ravi Shastri
Gilbert Jessop
Geoff Miller

 

[kyear2]

Will nominate Hooper as well.

 

[mr_mister]

i can't be bothered typing out my noms but essentially i've giving them to anyone who only needs a few more


Qualified:

Imran
Hadlee
Sobers
Botham
Miller
Kallis
Procter
Mankad
Flintoff
Grace
Kapil
Wilfred Rhodes
S Pollock
Chris Cairns
Dan Vettori
Klusener
Greig
Wasim
Hammond
Heath Streak
Shakib Al Hasan


21 in, 11 to go

 

[Midwinter]

Gilbert Jessop is worthy

 

[mr_mister]

as is Faulkner and IMO, Chaminda Vaas

both aren't far away and will probs make it in