Is Jacques Kallis Ken Barrington of modern age?

[OverratedSanity]

Does Joel Garner deserve similar criticism for his lack of 5fers? I know he was part of a far stronger attack which makes it harder to get big hauls but still.

 

[harsh.ag]

Does Joel Garner deserve similar criticism for his lack of 5fers? I know he was part of a far stronger attack which makes it harder to get big hauls but still.

He got 5 of his 7 5-fers while opening the bowling. That's also a factor. He got to open the bowling in just 26 of his 58 games.

 

[Red]

Does Joel Garner deserve similar criticism for his lack of 5fers? I know he was part of a far stronger attack which makes it harder to get big hauls but still.

Joel Garner deserves no criticism ever IMO.

 

[OverratedSanity]

awta

 

[Contra]

Pollock is a tremendous bowler and a record to be proud of, but if you're comparing him with the likes of Steyn, he falls short not so much because of his own ability but more because of the absolutely incredible and out of this world achievements of someone like Steyn. Pollock headed the bowling attack from 2002-2007 almost and it was during this time that South Africa fielded one of it's weakest bowling attacks (by it's own high standards). South Africa lost at home to England and lost in India in 04, lost in Pakistan in 03, lost in Sri Lanka in 06.

Now look at the difference Steyn made with his emergence in 07-08.
South Africa beat Australia in Australia in 08 and became number 1 team.
South Africa drew 1-1 twice in India when India were at their peak, making fools of Tendulkar, Dravid, Laxman, Dhoni etc.
South Africa beat Pakistan in 07
South Africa beat Sri Lanka in 14
South Africa beat England in 12.

So yes while their average might not be that different, if you break down those numbers, the gulf between them would be clear.

South Africa's incredible batting line up obviously has nothing to do with those achievements right? Clearly it was only Steyn who contributed...

 

[Black_Warrior]

Not 'only Steyn' as you put it, but he certainly had a major contribution. One player of course does not win a series but his performances surely went a long way in ensuring South African victories in SC. It's not a coincidence that his emergence and South Africa being number 1 team were at the same time.

 

[Contra]

Not 'only Steyn' as you put it, but he certainly had a major contribution. One player of course does not win a series but his performances surely went a long way in ensuring South African victories in SC. It's not a coincidence that his emergence and South Africa being number 1 team were at the same time.

I'm talking specifically about your reference to Pollock leading the SA attack when it was relatively weaker, Steyn is awesome no doubt, but the victories are as much a credit to the bowling attack he has supporting him as well as the fact that the SA batting line up is far superior to the one Pollock had when he was playing.

 

[Black_Warrior]

I would argue that Morkel is no better than Ntini who was supporting Pollock at that time..if anything one could possibly make an argument for Ntini being better than him...in fact Morkel has greatly benefitted from bowling with Steyn and people seem to describe them as "Steyn and Morkel' like they described "Wasim-Waqar" and "Ambrose-Walsh". The gulf between them is far greater, and were it not for the 'perceived excellence' of bowling with Steyn, I am not sure how many people would value Morkel.

Once again, if you look at those individual victories such as the one in India, Steyn pretty much knocked out the opposition on his own which set up the game for his team. Of course this is not to take the credit away from the development of Amla and De Villiers as batsmen which you seem to be alluding to, but South Africa's batting during Pollock's time was hardly weak..they had Smith and Kallis at their peak.

 

[cnerd123]

You're crazy. Morkel is gun. Would literally walk into any Test side in the world ATM.

 

[Cabinet96]

Steyn and Morkel also only have about 12 months worth of opening together in their career. Other than them being contrasting styles I don't really see why it's worth mentioning it as a partnership.

 

[Redsok]

Sobers was bit consistent across conditions, lot of flair, X factor, extremely versatile with the ball, even better fielder than Kallis. As a package it's understandable though their stats are almost identical.

Flair doesn't mean ****


Facts, logic and statistics all prove Kallis was the far superior All Rounder. Same level world class batsman, but a superior bowler and fielder.


Simple as that mate. Stop being so biased and ignorant

 

[the big bambino]

Stop being so biased and ignorant

Impressive that he's worked out Migara so quickly.