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Thread: JH Kallis v SM Pollock

  1. #31
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Personally I would rank Imran above all mentioned actually, certainly by far the bestof the big 4 of the 80s.
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  2. #32
    International Captain Swervy's Avatar
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    Imran was certainly better for longer...but i dont think anyone enjoyed the all round success that Botham did for the first 5 years of his international career (and that probably includes Sobers)
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  3. #33
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Botham, Imran, Kapil, Hadlee!
    Where on Earth do you pull those names from?
    How on Earth have they come to be ranked ahead of Keith Miller? Or, for that matter, Kallis and Pollock.
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  4. #34
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Hmm, let me see.

    Khan has scored more runs at a higher average than Miller, whilst simultaneously taking more than twice as many wickets at a cheaper cost.

    He also had to cope with the pressure of captaining and representing a nation that is far more fanatical about its cricket than Australia ever will be.

    That enough for you?


  5. #35
    International Regular twctopcat's Avatar
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    I'm beginning to wonder about some of richard's motives here as he just seems to be out to wind everyone up( notably marc ), with the endless smart **** drivel that he comes up with, just keep it to yourself sometimes.
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  6. #36
    International Captain Swervy's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Richard
    Botham, Imran, Kapil, Hadlee!
    Where on Earth do you pull those names from?
    How on Earth have they come to be ranked ahead of Keith Miller? Or, for that matter, Kallis and Pollock.
    what are you on about? 'Where on earth do you pull those names from' gives the impression you have never heard of Botham,Imran,kapil Dev and Hadlee.

    Each one of those 4 players has certainly had a bigger impact on test and ODI cricket than Kallis or Pollock as ALLROUNDERS...although Hadlee made a bigger impact with the ball than with the bat.

  7. #37
    World Traveller Craig's Avatar
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    Originally posted by marc71178
    Hmm, let me see.

    Khan has scored more runs at a higher average than Miller, whilst simultaneously taking more than twice as many wickets at a cheaper cost.

    He also had to cope with the pressure of captaining and representing a nation that is far more fanatical about its cricket than Australia ever will be.

    That enough for you?
    Before Liam goes and does so otherwise and posts stats to prove me wrong, I believe Khan's performances went up when got the captaincy.
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  8. #38
    International Captain Swervy's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Craig
    Before Liam goes and does so otherwise and posts stats to prove me wrong, I believe Khan's performances went up when got the captaincy.
    it is still a pressure though

  9. #39
    Cricketer Of The Year Adamc's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Craig
    Before Liam goes and does so otherwise and posts stats to prove me wrong, I believe Khan's performances went up when got the captaincy.
    Actually you are very much right:

    Khan batting as captain: 2408 runs at 52.34.
    Khan not as captain: 1399 at 25.43.

    Bowling as captain: 187 wickets at 20.26.
    Not as captain: 175 at 25.53.
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  10. #40
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    But wouldn't that make him an even greater player? ie the fact that he performed twice as well when given the responsibility of captaincy.
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  11. #41
    World Traveller Craig's Avatar
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    It would in fact.

  12. #42
    First Class Debutant SquidAU's Avatar
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    It is hard to say who would the the best all rounder out of Kallis and Pollock, so I will go with this....They are both the best at what they do ie Kallis' batting and Pollock's bowling...

  13. #43
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by marc71178
    Hmm, let me see.

    Khan has scored more runs at a higher average than Miller, whilst simultaneously taking more than twice as many wickets at a cheaper cost.

    He also had to cope with the pressure of captaining and representing a nation that is far more fanatical about its cricket than Australia ever will be.

    That enough for you?
    Keith Miller in First-Class cricket: bat ave 48.9; bowl ave 22.3
    Keith Miller in Test cricket: bat ave 36.97; bowl ave 22.97
    I suggest you check Imran Khan and the rest again, and then reconsider.
    Keith Miller's record is second only to Sobers' in the First-Class game. OK, he never had the chance to play the one-day game, but I'm pretty sure he'd have done rather well there, too.
    As for captaincy, if you'd played cricket to an especially high level or listened to those who had, once you're on the field everything disappears. It doesn't matter how many hollering fans or anything are around - this simply doesn't affect the best players.

  14. #44
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Swervy
    what are you on about? 'Where on earth do you pull those names from' gives the impression you have never heard of Botham,Imran,kapil Dev and Hadlee.

    Each one of those 4 players has certainly had a bigger impact on test and ODI cricket than Kallis or Pollock as ALLROUNDERS...although Hadlee made a bigger impact with the ball than with the bat.
    I have heard of them all...
    All of their achievements pale when compared to those of Keith Miller.

  15. #45
    International Captain Swervy's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Richard
    Keith Miller in First-Class cricket: bat ave 48.9; bowl ave 22.3
    Keith Miller in Test cricket: bat ave 36.97; bowl ave 22.97
    I suggest you check Imran Khan and the rest again, and then reconsider.
    Keith Miller's record is second only to Sobers' in the First-Class game. OK, he never had the chance to play the one-day game, but I'm pretty sure he'd have done rather well there, too.
    As for captaincy, if you'd played cricket to an especially high level or listened to those who had, once you're on the field everything disappears. It doesn't matter how many hollering fans or anything are around - this simply doesn't affect the best players.
    yes and there was Wally Hammond as well, and a whole host of other great allrounders, but as we werent around then, it is pretty hard to judge really how great these players were.

    i have no doubts at all that Miller was one of the greats, but you seem to be completely dismissing the 'big 4' of the 70's and 80's, infact you even said that Pollock and Kallis are better, when for people who actually saw Both,Imran,Dev and hadlee playing in their prime,that is pretty hard to swallow.

    kallis is no doubt a top batsman, but he doesnt compare to Botham in his prime,Imran,or hadlee or even Dev at his best.

    Pollock is a great bowler, but his batting is nowhere near as good as Botham(again in his prime),Imran or probably Kapil Dev's, and is probably around the same level as Hadlees.

    the of course you have the fielding, Botham was one of the great slip fielders you would ever want to see

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