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Thread: Sir Don Bradman vs Sir Gary Sobers

  1. #106
    International Regular kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    Kyear wouldn't go to a party even if Sobers invited him because he would be too busy looking up his stats. He is more in love with the idea of his stats than the man himself.
    Really?

    No.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

  2. #107
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    Kyear wouldn't go to a party even if Sobers invited him because he would be too busy looking up his stats. He is more in love with the idea of his stats than the man himself.
    kyear is one of the least stats oriented posters I can think of.

    And also, your joke is lame.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Jeets doesn't really deserve to be bowling.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Well yeah Tendy is probably better than Bradman, but Bradman was 70 years ago, if he grew up in the modern era he'd still easily be the best. Though he wasn't, can understand the argument for Tendy even though I don't agree.
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  3. #108
    State Vice-Captain schearzie's Avatar
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    I've always thought of Bradman as having the better cricket mind of all the ATG's as well as his batting. Is that a fair assessment, or is there someone I'm not giving credit to?
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  4. #109
    International Regular OverratedSanity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schearzie View Post
    I've always thought of Bradman as having the better cricket mind of all the ATG's as well as his batting. Is that a fair assessment, or is there someone I'm not giving credit to?
    Pretty much. I've always thought about Bradman as a great batsman having as much technical mastery and ability to strike the ball as other great batsmen... Not too much more.
    But he probably was the most mentally strong cricketer ever... Even if guys like Tendulkar and Lara went back to Bradman's time, they wouldn't average tha high because no matter what the condotion/opposition are, they are more prone to mistakes than Bradman. They'd throw their wicket away at some stage
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  5. #110
    State Vice-Captain schearzie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OverratedSanity View Post
    Pretty much. I've always thought about Bradman as a great batsman having as much technical mastery and ability to strike the ball as other great batsmen... Not too much more.
    But he probably was the most mentally strong cricketer ever... Even if guys like Tendulkar and Lara went back to Bradman's time, they wouldn't average tha high because no matter what the condotion/opposition are, they are more prone to mistakes than Bradman. They'd throw their wicket away at some stage
    I mean more that as Sobers is kept up by his fielding and bowling as extra bows to his string. I think Bradman was one the best thinking captains and cricketers ever.

  6. #111
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    kyear is one of the least stats oriented posters I can think of.

    And also, your joke is lame.
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    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

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  7. #112
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    Bradman was a smart man no doubt but he pulled some real boners in his time including his mistreatment of Grimmett and Miller and perhaps a lack of foresight that allowed the insurrection of WSC.

  8. #113
    Cricket Web Staff Member fredfertang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schearzie View Post
    I've always thought of Bradman as having the better cricket mind of all the ATG's as well as his batting. Is that a fair assessment, or is there someone I'm not giving credit to?
    Quote Originally Posted by OverratedSanity View Post
    Pretty much. I've always thought about Bradman as a great batsman having as much technical mastery and ability to strike the ball as other great batsmen... Not too much more.
    But he probably was the most mentally strong cricketer ever... Even if guys like Tendulkar and Lara went back to Bradman's time, they wouldn't average tha high because no matter what the condotion/opposition are, they are more prone to mistakes than Bradman. They'd throw their wicket away at some stage
    I think he had a tendency to be a bit too orthodox in his approach to captaincy - if he'd led the team with the same imagination as he batted with in 32/33 it would have been interesting , but otherwise I agree with both these posts

  9. #114
    State Vice-Captain schearzie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the big bambino View Post
    Bradman was a smart man no doubt but he pulled some real boners in his time including his mistreatment of Grimmett and Miller and perhaps a lack of foresight that allowed the insurrection of WSC.
    Nothing wrong with having a bonar. That aside.
    He had a great memory of things that had happened previously and would set fields accordingly.
    Also for someone as good as Miller to come into a side who was as dominant as Australia at the time, with his history in the War, would have been difficult to take Bradman and his attitude to the game seriously. Flip side Bradman had come into the side in the depression and was seen as a guiding light beyond cricket. Losing wasn't in his mind ever, so those minds weren't going to get along!

  10. #115
    State Captain harsh.ag's Avatar
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    Loved Bradman's "The Art of Cricket". His cricket mind was brilliant. Miller got exactly what he wanted from his teammates, I think - Expectations of intermittent greatness.

    Excerpt on swing bowling from the book:

    One of the most interesting parts of the matter is the knowledge that a cricket ball will not change direction in the air if travelling too fast.
    I have long held the view that a bowler of Tyson's pace could not produce the degree of swing which was achievable by a bowler of Bedser's pace.....

    Certain conditions are shown to be desirable in order that maximum swing may be obtained. They are :-
    1. A new ball with a shiny surface.
    2. A humid atmosphere, with cloud.
    3. A wind blowing from the right quarter.
    As these factors disappear, so will swing......

    There was a period in Australia when some cricket ball manufacturers, probably for reasons of economy, resorted to lacquering the surface of balls instead of shining them. The lacquer gives a beautiful bright, glossy finish. But that ball will not swing to anything like the same extent as one with the leather itself polished.....

    An interesting point about polishing the ball which may not be appreciated is that the bowler likes to have one side only shined up. A ball with one shiny side can be made to swing even though it has virtually no seam at all, but with no seam and two rough sides it probably couldn't.....

    Putting things in their simplest form so that bowlers will know what to do one may say the seam of a ball acts like a rudder. Point the seam towards slips and the ball will veer that way to become an out-swinger. Point the seam towards fine-leg, the reverse will happen and you will get an in-swinger....

    But the swinger which dips late, the ball which apparently is dead straight three quarters of the length of the pitch and then suddenly dips one way or the other, is the very devil. A late out-swinger which cuts away still further off the pitch will defeat anyone....

    One of the great sins of some new ball bowlers is that they will continue to bowl cartwheeled outswingers at the stumps so that the ball finishes well outside the off stump and the batsman can safely watch it go by whilst another bit of shine has gone off the ball....
    It is a great read, technical but interesting.
    Last edited by harsh.ag; 05-11-2013 at 03:08 AM.
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  11. #116
    Cricketer Of The Year Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    Really enjoyed reading that excerpt.
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  12. #117
    School Boy/Girl Cricketer Bushranger's Avatar
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    Bradman by a mile.

    Missed 7 years of international cricket in his prime due to WW2.

    Out of his 29 centuries 12 were Double centuries.

    Another thing that makes me think Bradman had no equal is that Jack Hobbs who is every all time team i can think of, of his 15 centuries only 1 was a Double century.
    Of Gary Sobers 26 centuries only 2 were more than double centuries.

    I hope this paints a picture further than just oh but Sobers could bowl.
    So Bradman played half the amount of Tests Sobers did scored 3 more centuries than Sobers and 10 more Double centuries.

    Its not even close.
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  13. #118
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Bradman by 1.75 miles

  14. #119
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    The gap between Bradman and Sobers is significantly large, but it's not as wide as we like to think if we look at Sober's best decade. And a decade is a long time if you think about it. For example;

    Bradman 1928-38, 1946-48 V ENG
    Years = 12
    Tests = 37
    Runs = 5028
    Ave = 89.78
    100s = 19
    50s = 12

    Best Decade: Don Bradman 1929-38, 1946 V ENG
    Test = 28
    Runs = 4197
    Ave = 99.50
    100s = 16
    50s = 8

    Best Decade: Garry Sobers 1958-68 V ENG
    Tests = 20
    Runs = 2098
    Ave = 82.07
    100s = 9
    50s = 7

    Best Decade: Sobers 1958-68
    Tests = 53
    Runs = 5511
    Ave = 71.57
    100s = 19
    50s = 21

    Another factor that makes Bradman standout above the rest is that it only too him 9 Test matches (20 months) to reach an average of 100. In other words he settled in to his role at No.3 and matured as a batsman amazingly quickly, no mucking about.

    Sobers on the other took 20 Tests to push is average into the 60s, and it wasn't till he'd been playing for 4-5 years did he really hit his straps and start piling on the runs.


    (Note: 'Best Decade' is according to what I could find using Statsguru. Other people might be able to improve the batting average of either player by choosing slightly different start and finish dates.)
    Last edited by watson; 11-11-2013 at 04:54 AM.

  15. #120
    International Regular kyear2's Avatar
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    Sobers also started out as a spin bowler.

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