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Thread: Sir Don Bradman vs Sir Gary Sobers

  1. #76
    Cricket Web Staff Member Burgey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karan316 View Post
    Firstly, the thread is more a comparison between Bradman and Sobers.

    Saying that one is the greatest batsmen and the other is the greatest cricketer is a bit too much tbh.
    Greatest of their time? Yes, would agree on that, but no the greatest.
    This argument gets trotted out time and again by the usual suspects.

    If you can't accept Bradman is the greatest batsman of all time, and by a vast margin, then it only confirms you haven't the first idea about cricket and really should be banned until you remove your head from your own fundamental orrifice.
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  2. #77
    Cricket Web Staff Member Burgey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karan316 View Post
    The statement that the 2 are the greatest was a bit too much tbh.
    At present, there is so much competition and the level of cricket is so high that its hard to rate some old greats above everyone else.
    And the pressure involved, the amount of professionalism, high quality fielding, number of quality teams have all changed with time.
    In India, with the number of people taking up cricket, there are more chances of you getting struck by lightning than getting selected for the national team. So just reaching that level is a big thing, unlike before.


    And the thread is just a comparison between 2 given players, so lets keep it to that.
    The level of cricket is high now? Really? I think the level of cricket at international level now is for the most part piss weak. SA are a very good side, the rest are pretty mediocre really.
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  3. #78
    International Regular OverratedSanity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karan316 View Post
    The statement that the 2 are the greatest was a bit too much tbh.
    At present, there is so much competition and the level of cricket is so high that its hard to rate some old greats above everyone else.
    And the pressure involved, the amount of professionalism, high quality fielding, number of quality teams have all changed with time.
    In India, with the number of people taking up cricket, there are more chances of you getting struck by lightning than getting selected for the national team. So just reaching that level is a big thing, unlike before.


    And the thread is just a comparison between 2 given players, so lets keep it to that.


    at those parts in particular. Look, I don't intend to be mean, but your whole point basically boils down to great Cricketer A is better than Great Cricketer B because he's more recent. That's just a piss weak argument
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  4. #79
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    And even if you're right karan, you can't hold Bradman to the standards of today. It's like saying some random olden day player > Tendulkar because he batted on uncovered pitches. All you can ask is for a player to succeed in the circumstances presented to them, because the past is done and dusted and you can't predict the future.

    Bradman is the best because he is the most successful. Put more simply, he averaged 100 for years and years. There are probably a few batsmen who average 80+ against a couple of top four sides over 10 tests, but over decades? That doesn't happen, It's freakish.
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    Well yeah Tendy is probably better than Bradman, but Bradman was 70 years ago, if he grew up in the modern era he'd still easily be the best. Though he wasn't, can understand the argument for Tendy even though I don't agree.
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    State Vice-Captain karan316's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OverratedSanity View Post
    at those parts in particular. Look, I don't intend to be mean, but your whole point basically boils down to great Cricketer A is better than Great Cricketer B because he's more recent. That's just a piss weak argument
    No, cricketers who succeed in a professional era > cricketers who succeed in an unprofessional/semi professional era.
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  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by karan316 View Post
    No, cricketers who succeed in a professional era > cricketers who succeed in an unprofessional/semi professional era.
    ...which boils down to "great Cricketer A is better than Great Cricketer B because he's more recent". You can only play what is put in front of you, and at the time you just so happen to have been alive, tbh.
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  7. #82
    International Regular OverratedSanity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karan316 View Post
    No, cricketers who succeed in a professional era > cricketers who succeed in an unprofessional/semi professional era.
    No... Players who achieve more success > others... Regardless of era
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  8. #83
    State Vice-Captain karan316's Avatar
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    Ok, lets not stretch this topic, the same old discussions will be repeated.

    Lets stick to the thread.

  9. #84
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    The thread doesn't make sense. Sobers played in as professional an era and excelled at fielding as much as anyone today. Granted fitness and training didn't reach today's standards until WSC but on the individual level Bradman and Sobers were both as professional as players today even if team levels and most players were not quite on that level.
    Bradman retired less than a decade before Sobers and Sobers retired the year before Richards and Lara replaced Richards in his team. There is a continuity and yes bowling did improve from the mid fifties up until the peak of the 90's with the exception of McGrath, Warne, Murali and Steyn it has decreased since. Bradman was the best, by how much is arguable, but to suggest otherwise is an expression of ignorance. To quote another website, the only persons who suggest that Kallis is a better batsman and all rounder that Sobers are those who never seen Garry bat.
    They are the two greatest Test players to have played the game and its after those two that the argument starts.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

  10. #85
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    IMO Bradman stands head and shoulders above everyone else.

    I think you can make a case against Sobers for not being too far ahead of other cricketer. But Bradman is just a freak
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

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  11. #86
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    IMO Bradman stands head and shoulders above everyone else.

    I think you can make a case against Sobers for not being too far ahead of other cricketer. But Bradman is just a freak
    I don't rate too highly what previous players have to say about their contemporaries as they are generally biased towards them. Keith Miller played with Bradman and without question stated that he was cleary the best batsman ever, but Sobers was the best cricketer ever. Chappelli, as Australian as they come has a similar perspective.

    Numerous publications I have read have stated that there has been three superstars of the game in Grace, Bradman and Sobers who stood above all others and when the scope is limited to Tests then is just the Don and Sir Garry. When Wisden named their 5 players of the century Bradman scored a perfect 100, Sobers came in next with 90 votes, no one else came close.
    They are 1 and 1A no matter what order you choose to place them.

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    Bradman is freak . ok
    WG ? freakiest ??

    take any area or subject , freaky phenomenons happens only in the beginning stage where things are not so professional , not so organised , there are lot to mature , lot to find out..

    BRADAMAN was an ULTIMATE PROFESSIONAL cricketer in a NOT SO PROFESSIONAL era. that (+ his talent) made him a freak
    why there is no SFB , WG , BRADMAN , HEADLEY , HOBBS after 40 , these days ??

    Sobers is different . he is definitely better than any player after him. just because he was not limited to one skill. and INARGUABLY 1 of 3 greatest players of all time. and his worst ranking should be no:3 behind WG and Bradman. But Bradman and WG can be placed anywhere in.. say.. top 15 cricketers ranking

    its not Viv's / Sunny's / Sachin's/ Lara's fault they played more competitive cricket

    no cricketer combined 3 skills of cricket like Sobers did.
    arguably (BEST BATSMAN OF ALL TIME + BEST FIELDER OF ALL TIME ) + good bowler ( varieties )
    you may argue Kallis is equally good , which is rubbish.. stats from certain angles may show kallis>=sobers . greatness not lies in numbers alone.
    Last edited by VKN payyans; 03-11-2013 at 10:59 AM.

  13. #88
    Cricket Web Staff Member Burgey's Avatar
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    Freaks only happen at the beginning of sports? Glad I was around in the late 80s/ early 90s when basketball started and I got to see Michael Jordan play.
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  14. #89
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VKN payyans View Post
    Bradman is freak . ok
    WG ? freakiest ??

    take any area or subject , freaky phenomenons happens only in the beginning stage where things are not so professional , not so organised , there are lot to mature , lot to find out..

    BRADAMAN was an ULTIMATE PROFESSIONAL cricketer in a NOT SO PROFESSIONAL era. that (+ his talent) made him a freak
    why there is no SFB , WG , BRADMAN , HEADLEY , HOBBS after 40 , these days ??

    Sobers is different . he is definitely better than any player after him. just because he was not limited to one skill. and INARGUABLY 1 of 3 greatest players of all time. and his worst ranking should be no:3 behind WG and Bradman. But Bradman and WG can be placed anywhere in.. say.. top 15 cricketers ranking

    its not Viv's / Sunny's / Sachin's/ Lara's fault they played more competitive cricket

    no cricketer combined 3 skills of cricket like Sobers did.
    arguably (BEST BATSMAN OF ALL TIME + BEST FIELDER OF ALL TIME ) + good bowler ( varieties )
    you may argue Kallis is equally good , which is rubbish.. stats from certain angles may show kallis>=sobers . greatness not lies in numbers alone.
    You're such a tool. Seriously.

    Bradman was twice as good as most of his peers, and twice as good as most people in history.

    Plenty of other batmen are roughly as good as Sobers. Plenty of bowlers have been way better than him. Plenty of fielders have been as good or better than him.

    You could cautiously say that Sobers is the second greatest batsman ever. But that's highly debatable, especially using your logic.

  15. #90
    International Vice-Captain centurymaker's Avatar
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    Freaks do come along only when the game hasn't developed as much. You won't find another Bradman ever again!

    But that doesn't mean that Bradman isn't the best batsman ever by a fair distance.
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