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Thread: South Africa - A Worthy No. 1

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    South Africa - A Worthy No. 1

    I realize the zip incident may make some of us a bit impartial towards the Saffers, but I am willing to treat it as a one-off incident and leave it at that.

    At a time when the standard of test cricket has plummeted worldwide, we must recognize SA as a truly worthy no.1 team. Any no.1 team must set the pace for the rest of the world to follow, perform in all conditions and have the ambition of champs, and SA qualify.

    When Australia were dethroned in 2008, India took over the mantle under Dhoni's leadership. Yet fine a captain as Dhoni was, he took his team to the top by virtue of success at home more than anything abroad. India boasted a great batting lineup but their bowling, with only Zaheer and Harbi as standouts, was the worst of any no.1 team ever. An 8-0 thrashing in England and Australia vanished any pretensions to greatness for this team.

    England promptly crushed India at home in 2011 and, backed by a jubilant British press, were seen to be marching towards domination worldwide. This balloon was popped by Pakistan and Sri Lanka as England lost 4 tests on the trot. Then SA toured England and ended debate on who was best once and for all. The English team looked good on paper, but lacked consistency and had a soft underbelly that was exposed under pressure.

    SA, since taking over as no.1, beat Australia away in a hard fought series, whitewashed NZ and Pakistan at home (thus removing their relatively poor record of finishing home series), and have become the first team to win a test in the UAE. They have two of the last remaining all-time greats in cricket (Steyn and Kallis), and potential greats in Amla, DeVilliers and Philander. Their batters can adjust well to pace and spin, and under Smith's leadership, their away record is even better than Australia in their prime (unbeaten since 2006). And as they've shown in this series, when you do beat them they come back roaring.

    So, zipper incident notwithstanding, thank you SA for being one of the few team to consistently deliver quality test cricket, still the best to watch.

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    Cricketer Of The Year Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    I would definitely say that they are a worthy No.1. Maintaining a 7 year away record and destroying teams at home is a remarkable achievement. Plus with the brilliant players they have not many teams are going to beat them in the short-run. I however doubt that they will maintain it for long though. Peterson is average and Smith (despite his century in the last game) is past it. Kallis is also in decline and they don't have a good spinner or a 3rd bowler.

    I don't see the big deal about zipgate, since they had won the match before it happened and I don't really see the big deal with slightly altering the state of the ball like that since it gives us reverse swing (much better for the game). However, to do it when you are winning indicates that it wasn't a one off incident.
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    Just wait til they face some real rank turners #gambhir

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    State Vice-Captain MrPrez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    I would definitely say that they are a worthy No.1. Maintaining a 7 year away record and destroying teams at home is a remarkable achievement. Plus with the brilliant players they have not many teams are going to beat them in the short-run. I however doubt that they will maintain it for long though. Peterson is average and Smith (despite his century in the last game) is past it. Kallis is also in decline and they don't have a good spinner or a 3rd bowler.
    Honestly, Morkel is probably the best "3rd bowler" in the world. No bias, of course, but he gets massively underrated because Steyn and Philander are so ridiculously good. He's honestly a great bowler would make any team in the world, imo.

    However, to do it when you are winning indicates that it wasn't a one off incident.
    This is exactly what annoys me over the incident. I just feel completely compromised as a fan, knowing that there is probably a trend of undercover tampering both within the South African team, and most probably throughout the whole Test scene. I mean, Ian O'Brien tweeted something along the lines of "All teams tamper with the ball; some are just clever than others."
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    Cricketer Of The Year Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    Spin twins Sir Jaddu and Ashwin to destroy RSA.
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    International Debutant harsh.ag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by subshakerz View Post
    I realize the zip incident may make some of us a bit impartial towards the Saffers, but I am willing to treat it as a one-off incident and leave it at that.

    At a time when the standard of test cricket has plummeted worldwide, we must recognize SA as a truly worthy no.1 team. Any no.1 team must set the pace for the rest of the world to follow, perform in all conditions and have the ambition of champs, and SA qualify.

    When Australia were dethroned in 2008, India took over the mantle under Dhoni's leadership. Yet fine a captain as Dhoni was, he took his team to the top by virtue of success at home more than anything abroad. India boasted a great batting lineup but their bowling, with only Zaheer and Harbi as standouts, was the worst of any no.1 team ever. An 8-0 thrashing in England and Australia vanished any pretensions to greatness for this team.

    England promptly crushed India at home in 2011 and, backed by a jubilant British press, were seen to be marching towards domination worldwide. This balloon was popped by Pakistan and Sri Lanka as England lost 4 tests on the trot. Then SA toured England and ended debate on who was best once and for all. The English team looked good on paper, but lacked consistency and had a soft underbelly that was exposed under pressure.

    SA, since taking over as no.1, beat Australia away in a hard fought series, whitewashed NZ and Pakistan at home (thus removing their relatively poor record of finishing home series), and have become the first team to win a test in the UAE. They have two of the last remaining all-time greats in cricket (Steyn and Kallis), and potential greats in Amla, DeVilliers and Philander. Their batters can adjust well to pace and spin, and under Smith's leadership, their away record is even better than Australia in their prime (unbeaten since 2006). And as they've shown in this series, when you do beat them they come back roaring.

    So, zipper incident notwithstanding, thank you SA for being one of the few team to consistently deliver quality test cricket, still the best to watch.
    Don't agree, WADR. SA, Eng and Ind have better teams than any in their recent history. Australia are still a good team. Sri Lanka, too, are a very good team, almost as good as the early-mid noughties one. Pakistan and Windies have fallen slightly out of grace.

    SA are very much the number 1, and look set to retain the position given that only Kallis is the one looking at retirement. Yup, I am very grateful to South Africa for the consistently solid cricket they have provided over the last few years, both with the bat and the ball.

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    Cricketer Of The Year Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPrez View Post
    Honestly, Morkel is probably the best "3rd bowler" in the world. No bias, of course, but he gets massively underrated because Steyn and Philander are so ridiculously good. He's honestly a great bowler would make any team in the world, imo.

    This is exactly what annoys me over the incident. I just feel completely compromised as a fan, knowing that there is probably a trend of undercover tampering both within the South African team, and most probably throughout the whole Test scene. I mean, Ian O'Brien tweeted something along the lines of "All teams tamper with the ball; some are just clever than others."
    I don't know why it bothers you. Tampering with nails and zips isn't that much of a big deal and anyway we got to see Steyn reverse the ball.

    Finn is a better 3rd bowler.

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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    yep. South Africa are a pretty darned good side.
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    Finn is a better 3rd bowler.
    Nah, only 3rd pace bowler that has a case for being better than Morkel is Siddle in a full strength Aus attack. Unless you're NUFAN and you think he's their 1st ofc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by harsh.skm View Post
    Don't agree, WADR. SA, Eng and Ind have better teams than any in their recent history. Australia are still a good team. Sri Lanka, too, are a very good team, almost as good as the early-mid noughties one. Pakistan and Windies have fallen slightly out of grace.

    SA are very much the number 1, and look set to retain the position given that only Kallis is the one looking at retirement. Yup, I am very grateful to South Africa for the consistently solid cricket they have provided over the last few years, both with the bat and the ball.
    England you could argue that their Ashes 2005 team was better than their current lot, but Ill give you this one. Indian have lost their entire famed batting lineup along with their major bowlers, they are in rebuild mold, and their stock clearly has dropped since they were beaten away 8-0 and England took down their fortress. Australia are nothing compared to the team of the past, and have been in transition for the last 3-4 years. Sri Lanka were a better team with Murali and Vaas, now they don't represent much of a threat outside home. Pakistan, NZ and WI are all y'know compared to times past.

    Pretty much SA and England are the only ones with test teams in better health than maybe 10 years ago. For the rest, the standards have dropped.

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    U19 Vice-Captain JontyPanesar's Avatar
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    Maybe so, but I don't think they're very deep. Injury could expose this side
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    Quote Originally Posted by harsh.skm View Post
    Don't agree
    Agree
    If I only just posted the above post, please wait 5 mins before replying as there is bound to be edits

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    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Without question the best team in world cricket today with England clearly second. Their pace is potentially ATG and one of the better ones in history. The batting features Amla, Smith, Kallis and de Villiers with adequate support their fielding is top notch. A.B is also improving behind the stumps and along with Kallis provides excellent balance to the team.
    Zippergate not with standing they play the game it should be played, an attacking unrelenting form of cricket. Not much to find fault with this unit.
    Last edited by kyear2; 26-10-2013 at 12:09 PM.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Cameron+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

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    State Vice-Captain MrPrez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Without question the best team in world cricket today with England clearly second. Their pace is potentially ATG and one of the better ones in history. The batting features Smith, Kallis and de Villiers with adequate support their fielding is top notch. A.B is also improving behind the stumps and along with Kallis provides excellent balance to the team.
    Zippergate not with standing they play the game it should be played, an attacking unrelenting form of cricket. Not much to find fault with this unit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    I don't know why it bothers you. Tampering with nails and zips isn't that much of a big deal and anyway we got to see Steyn reverse the ball.

    Finn is a better 3rd bowler.
    Because it's completely against the rules?

    Lol. The argument I was expecting was for Australia's 3rd bowler, whomever it may be. Finn has been struggling to keep his place in the England team. When you're keeping Kyle Abbot and Marchant de Lange out of the team after their respective starts to Test cricket, you've got to be pretty damn good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daemon View Post
    Nah, only 3rd pace bowler that has a case for being better than Morkel is Siddle in a full strength Aus attack. Unless you're NUFAN and you think he's their 1st ofc.
    Who would you have ahead of Siddle? I'm not saying you're wrong, but he seems to be the only fixture in their bowling line-up amidst injuries, changes in form etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPrez View Post
    Who would you have ahead of Siddle?
    Pattinson, Harris and Siddle are all better bowlers than Morkel. Having Pattinson and Harris fit at the one time is a rarity though.
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