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**Official** Indian Domestic Season 2013/14

Manee

Cricketer Of The Year
Hopefully Umesh gets a big ten in this match, and at least two more. That will help his cause as an India strike bowler, not just in Tests, but also in ODIs, where we're seeing weak bowlers picked as ODI specialists.
Umesh is not currently cut out for ODI cricket. He's had his chances and he has been poor. He did nothing of note in the Challenger Trophy. How he performs here should not impact on ODI selection, totally different formats.
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
Maybe after the season ends. I wouldn't rule out picking the bloke on form. India's ODI specialists are poor on flat decks anyway.
 

Manee

Cricketer Of The Year
Maybe after the season ends. I wouldn't rule out picking the bloke on form. India's ODI specialists are poor on flat decks anyway.
Along with everyone else. But they are better on helpful decks. Hence, the likes of B Kumar and Vinay Kumar have better records then Yadav.
 

JontyPanesar

U19 Vice-Captain
Maybe after the season ends. I wouldn't rule out picking the bloke on form. India's ODI specialists are poor on flat decks anyway.
Which bowler, of any country, is great on flat decks in ODIs? You're way too quick to slag off bowlers for struggling in flat, limited-overs matches. Those matches are guaranteed runfests
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
Which bowler, of any country, is great on flat decks in ODIs? You're way too quick to slag off bowlers for struggling in flat, limited-overs matches. Those matches are guaranteed runfests
England's bowlers, who won a Test series against India. The combo of Steyn and Morkel, with the support. Why, even Australia's inexperienced Starc-Cummins-Pattinson-Johnson (left-and-right jokes notwithstanding) have had some strength on flats. Flat decks are not an excuse for poor bowling. If these bowlers are not good enough on flats, they're simply not good enough, because the team's not winning. We see such remarks about Indian batsmen struggling on seaming wickets, so why not pull up so many Indian bowlers who are incompetent when it doesn't help them?
Along with everyone else. But they are better on helpful decks. Hence, the likes of B Kumar and Vinay Kumar have better records then Yadav.
You would, however, need someone at Yadav's pace to win more matches, instead of mere sessions. A more valid reason to keep him out is that he's not played much active cricket, is not in prime form and is a little raw. Let's follow the whole season. Unless you're rolling in options at high pace, you can't rule anyone out unless that someone has lost pace, like Munaf or Ishant.

In other news, all four spinners who bowled today (Nadeem, Sunny, Chawla, Jalaj) have bowled nearly 200 overs, with just 13 wickets between them, at an average of 45. Hang on, spinners? More like flat bowlers. Some hope for the spin camp was when Ojha, Baba and Ranga got a rich haul in the first innings. Ojha getting a few wickets should be a hint for Harbhajan to scalp more.
 

JontyPanesar

U19 Vice-Captain
England's bowlers, who won a Test series against India. The combo of Steyn and Morkel, with the support. Why, even Australia's inexperienced Starc-Cummins-Pattinson-Johnson (left-and-right jokes notwithstanding) have had some strength on flats. Flat decks are not an excuse for poor bowling. If these bowlers are not good enough on flats, they're simply not good enough, because the team's not winning. We see such remarks about Indian batsmen struggling on seaming wickets, so why not pull up so many Indian bowlers who are incompetent when it doesn't help them?
But flat tracks in limited overs often lead to 180 v. 170 or 350 v. 310. Did the bowlers of both sides bowl crap the entire time? Morkel has bowled tons of filth and been hammered in test matches, not to mention some horrendous one day matches. Jimmy's ODI record is filled with spankings on flat pitches.
I think your point about bowling well on flat pitches in Tests is well-taken, but when Ishwar Pandey gets smacked by Chris Gayle on a flat pitch in the IPL, my confidence in Pandey isn't exactly shaken.
The latter point about Indian bowlers not extracting maximum help from seaming conditions is also fair.
 

Daemon

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India's limited overs formula with the ball is all about damage control imo. Other than Bhuvneshwar with the new ball, none of our bowlers actually search for wickets do they? Nearly 75% of the time a bowling change is made, the new bowler is just trying his best to clean up the mess the previous one has left behind.

I forgot what point I was trying to make. Carry on.
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
But flat tracks in limited overs often lead to 180 v. 170 or 350 v. 310. Did the bowlers of both sides bowl crap the entire time? Morkel has bowled tons of filth and been hammered in test matches, not to mention some horrendous one day matches. Jimmy's ODI record is filled with spankings on flat pitches.
I think your point about bowling well on flat pitches in Tests is well-taken, but when Ishwar Pandey gets smacked by Chris Gayle on a flat pitch in the IPL, my confidence in Pandey isn't exactly shaken.
The latter point about Indian bowlers not extracting maximum help from seaming conditions is also fair.
You've mentioned two green-top bullies, who get spanked on flat decks, and end up bruised and battered, but still survive and take a few sticks each time. The Indian bowling, on the other hand, simply capitulates on a flat deck, often handing the match on a platter. Observe how India's bowling surrendered, and Australia's bowling posed a threat on a flat deck against a batting side that is by no means weak. The pacers simply had no firepower to survive the Pune pitch.

Pandey was just two seasons old when he was smashed out of the IPL by Gayle. After a third season, he'll get better, and fourth, even better. Let him play that much first. And build up serious pace.
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
This bloke has some seriously impressive OD/T20 figures. A strike rate of exactly 30 is no mean feat, over 55 games, and also comes packaged with an economy rate of 4.47, and he's also capable with the bat, and keeps it tight in T20s. What's stopping the selectors from picking him?
 

Manee

Cricketer Of The Year
Absolutely disappointing. Knockouts should be done away with, and replaced with a league with a points system.
I want to see more Duleep Trophy. It is not ideal because people have no allegiances. However, I think the standard of Ranji Trophy is still too low. The best players average 60-70 over a season in Ranji Trophy cricket and this is not limited to one player. Tendulkar averages 80 for Bombay and 109 for Mumbai. Dravid averaged 76 for Karnataka. Laxman averaged 80 for Hyderabad. I know these players are/were great but this is too high. We should have a system where the greats average 45-65, domestically. This sort of average inflation means that someone averaging 55 for his state might be a fine Test player or an absolute hack. It is why we have no idea whether to persevere with the likes of Mukund and Rahane and even Badrinath.
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
I want to see more Duleep Trophy. It is not ideal because people have no allegiances. However, I think the standard of Ranji Trophy is still too low. The best players average 60-70 over a season in Ranji Trophy cricket and this is not limited to one player. Tendulkar averages 80 for Bombay and 109 for Mumbai. Dravid averaged 76 for Karnataka. Laxman averaged 80 for Hyderabad. I know these players are/were great but this is too high. We should have a system where the greats average 45-65, domestically. This sort of average inflation means that someone averaging 55 for his state might be a fine Test player or an absolute hack. It is why we have no idea whether to persevere with the likes of Mukund and Rahane and even Badrinath.
I feel the introduction of foreign players in the Ranji Trophy will raise the bar. One or two a team, like it is in England. That way, when the Indian national players are away, the standard does not go down, nor are teams negatively impacted.

The three-tier system should also be replaced with the original zonal format, which eventually leads to a Super Eights group, and scrapping the knockouts altogether for a points system that rewards attacking cricket. The leading point scorer gets the trophy.

The Ranji Trophy has been prolonged, but ideally, it should be shrunken, to accommodate a longer Duleep Trophy, which should have the winner decided by a points system, and no knockouts. The downside of that is that you'll have a winner decided before the event ends, much like football leagues.
 

JontyPanesar

U19 Vice-Captain
I feel the introduction of foreign players in the Ranji Trophy will raise the bar. One or two a team, like it is in England. That way, when the Indian national players are away, the standard does not go down, nor are teams negatively impacted.

The three-tier system should also be replaced with the original zonal format, which eventually leads to a Super Eights group, and scrapping the knockouts altogether for a points system that rewards attacking cricket. The leading point scorer gets the trophy.

The Ranji Trophy has been prolonged, but ideally, it should be shrunken, to accommodate a longer Duleep Trophy, which should have the winner decided by a points system, and no knockouts. The downside of that is that you'll have a winner decided before the event ends, much like football leagues.
Largely agree with your thoughts though I don't know how much foreigners can really improve the standard play if they can only have 1-2 players. In my ideal world, players would have the freedom to play wherever and domestic FC teams from all over the world would play in a champions league :)

Wasn't a huge fan of the original zonal format. I'd rather have the a tiered system that only allows the top league to win the trophy, that too only through points.
First-class cricket is not conducive to knockout play, so I'm totally with you there.
Removing knockouts and only allowing the first tier teams to win the trophy would give more space in the schedule for the Duleep Trophy, which I do agree needs to be expanded (the quality of players is more concentrated).
 

Arjun

Cricketer Of The Year
Largely agree with your thoughts though I don't know how much foreigners can really improve the standard play if they can only have 1-2 players. In my ideal world, players would have the freedom to play wherever and domestic FC teams from all over the world would play in a champions league :)

Wasn't a huge fan of the original zonal format. I'd rather have the a tiered system that only allows the top league to win the trophy, that too only through points.
First-class cricket is not conducive to knockout play, so I'm totally with you there.
Removing knockouts and only allowing the first tier teams to win the trophy would give more space in the schedule for the Duleep Trophy, which I do agree needs to be expanded (the quality of players is more concentrated).
The advantage of having foreign players will be incremental, if not drastic. When the Indian frontline players are away, the standard of the Ranji Trophy falls to sub-IPL levels. Getting foreign players into teams when they are not playing for their national sides will add quality- there won't be easy runs/wickets/lead-pinches then.

A tweaked version of the zonal league system is where the super league doesn't have the top two teams per zone- but the top eight teams from all over the country, on points alone. To get more points, teams will have to win, and win big. You may even end up with something more skewed towards a particular zone, but this time, it will be earned. Teams have to play to win to make the Super League.
 

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