***Official*** New Zealand in Bangladesh & Sri Lanka 2013

[Flem274*]

Ok, but there are gonna be times outside the SC when you need a spinner other than KW, and in any case, I'm a huge advocate for picking specialist spinners on pretty much any surface, but if it's a greentop KW probably would suffice

We don't have any fit ones unless Sodhi has just announced himself.

 

[_Ed_]

Am I the only one who thought that was going for six as soon as he hit it?

I'm confused by the contrasting reactions to the shot between posts here and the Cricinfo commentary...

"hits it high in the air and over the midwicket fence for a six. some wonderful hitting. "

 

[hendrix]

Ok, but there are gonna be times outside the SC when you need a spinner other than KW, and in any case, I'm a huge advocate for picking specialist spinners on pretty much any surface, but if it's a greentop KW probably would suffice

agreed, but such a spinner needs to be at the very least tight. Lyon works in that case. Jeetan Patel would work. Sodhi as a young leggy would not be tight enough. Bartin has shown he can't be relied on for that unless you're England ("Oh look at that chaps, he's bowling full tosses and long hops, we better block him out").

In this case we're better off picking a good line and length bowler like Butler so the other seamers can rotate.

 

[hendrix]

I'm confused by the contrasting reactions to the shot between posts here and the Cricinfo commentary...

"hits it high in the air and over the midwicket fence for a six. some wonderful hitting. "

2 men at cow corner. A deliberate hit in the air over cow corner.

poor shot considering the match situation.

 

[Hurricane]

Ross might've provided better numbers, notably in Sri Lanka, but the general acceptance was he was a much less proactive captain, exuded a less than adequate body language and reaction to his bowlers, and wasn't the sort of leader a nation scrapping away near the bottom required.

Ross was a better test match captain and achieved some overseas test victories Baz is too proactive e.g. batting first in South Africa and getting bowled out for 45. But yes agree Ross did lose the support of the team through reasons such as negative body language and the team basically looking to make any change to turn things around. I would like to comment on the body language issue and that is really the only reason I am replying to your post otherwise I would have let it go. For some people having a leader who exudes confidence and has positive energy is more important than the competence of that leader in his day to day decision making. I am not including you in that list. I speak from the experience in the workplace. People want to feel engaged, energized and to have fun primarily, and achieving results for the company (or team in this instance) is less important than feeling personally engaged. My disclaimer here is that if you are an extremely dynamic leader but actually completely let the wheels fall off the cart then people will get peeved with that eventually. But only after a long time. My point is philosophically about the difference between having a "charismatic leader" or a "skilled manager" in charge.

 

[Flem274*]

agreed, but such a spinner needs to be at the very least tight. Lyon works in that case. Jeetan Patel would work. Sodhi as a young leggy would not be tight enough. Bartin has shown he can't be relied on for that unless you're England ("Oh look at that chaps, he's bowling full tosses and long hops, we better block him out").

In this case we're better off picking a good line and length bowler like Butler so the other seamers can rotate.

Hendrix stahp

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah, the execution of the shot was fine, but it could've so easily been McCullum all over again if he got it just a bit wrong. And an edge through the slips! Tighten up CJ.

 

[BeeGee]

Hugely important partnership. Well done, lads.

Williamson loves the SC.

 

[hendrix]

Hendrix stahp

you agree in principal just not personnel though right?

Sodhi as the lone spinner in a 4 man attack outside of the subcontinent...not quite ready yet and even here we need the backup of Anderson.

 

[Flem274*]

On the Taylor captaincy change - from what I remember of it, it was the seniors (McCullum, Vettori, Oram, Mills) who were the big movers behind the scenes. The younger members of the side respected both Taylor and McCullum and tried to stay well out of it. The complaints o the seniors were he wasn't a good tactician and was very quiet and aloof, whereas McCullum was a people person.

I never really had an issue with his body language through the telly, but that's the thing, I only saw him on TV. My biggest criticism would be he was quite conservative.

edit: I will add McCullum setting such a dire downhill skiing example with the bat is just as bad as not having shouty body language. Thankfully it appears the specialist batsmen in the squad try to play to the situation, Rutherford excepted who just can't help himself.

 

[Flem274*]

you agree in principal just not personnel though right?

Sodhi as the lone spinner in a 4 man attack outside of the subcontinent...not quite ready yet and even here we need the backup of Anderson.

Yup, though I'd give Sodhi a run now he's bowled well, barring a second innings meltdown of course.

 

[Mike5181]

McCullum is a much better captain tbh.

 

[Maximas]

Yeah, at least let Sodhi try and prove himself outside the SC before jumping to conclusions, I mean, we all seemed to think Sodhi was a bad pick here but now we are all saying he's a decent SC spin-bowling option.

 

[Flem274*]

McCullum is a much better captain tbh.

Yeah he's a much better tactician, I don't debate that. Taylor wasn't' *bad*, McCullum is just very very clever at manouvering his pieces.

 

[Bahnz]

Anyway, terrific recovery and it's great to see it come from the youngest members of the top 6. Still, we're at least 200 away from calling it job done.

 

[hendrix]

Yeah, at least let Sodhi try and prove himself outside the SC before jumping to conclusions, I mean, we all seemed to think Sodhi was a bad pick here but now we are all saying he's a decent SC spin-bowling option.

My opinion on that hasn't changed. It was a bad pick. It's great that it worked out and he bowled well yesterday, but I think it's best to ease him into it.

 

[Flem274*]

Well shortcuts don't work 99% of the time, and NZC are trying to take shortcuts with Sodhi, so this will bite us in the arse this summer. I'm extremely dubious he announced himself yesterday and will be test standard from this point forward. He's going to cop some absolute pastings over the next few seasons if he keeps getting picked, but hopefully there will be some good performances in between the dross to make it worthwhile.

 

[_Ed_]

I'd love to see us send him back to FC level after this - he can go back on a bit of a high after a highly encouraging introduction to Tests. That should give him a ton of confidence and do him a world of good. Then he can return again at a later date.

Only problem with that is who do we pick when we need a spinner? Bartin's not up to it, I'm afraid.

 

[Flem274*]

is this **** on 75* already? ****ing hell.

 

[hendrix]

I'd love to see us send him back to FC level after this - he can go back on a bit of a high after a highly encouraging introduction to Tests. That should give him a ton of confidence and do him a world of good. Then he can return again at a later date.

Only problem with that is who do we pick when we need a spinner? Bartin's not up to it, I'm afraid.

We pick him when we need a spinner, but we shouldn't need one against WI and India in our back yard.