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Alastair Cook - Will he break all the England records?

Adwin

Cricket Spectator
Has Cook's style developed like this due to a Boycott "occupy the crease at all costs" mentality of opening batsman or because he's technically inferior to players like Ian Bell and Michael Clarke and hence couldn't be a successful no.3, 4 or 5 batsman?
I'd say he has to work harder for his runs than the likes of Clarke, definitely. It's almost as though each scoring shot requires a full mental review of every lesson he's had since a schoolboy before he executes. Root looks the same so far.
Perhaps that's why they like to open? Less pressure to attempt flamboyant strokes, scoring rate not a consideration? Or maybe they've learned to play within themselves because of their fondness for opening? Chicken/Egg, perhaps. What I would suggest is that Cook is pretty much a one-speed player. I can't say I've ever seen him try to smash the leather off a ball to get the rate up. Perhaps that's a symptom of every single delivery triggering a meticulous and methodical thought process, restricting the time he has to choose a shot and removing all chance of instinct guiding his selection.

Tl;dr - he probably isn't as naturally talented as players like Clarke, so has to work extra hard for his runs, something which may not be desirable in the middle order.
 
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Neil Pickup

Cricket Web Moderator
That's the big issue, not just with cricket, but with all sports in this country. Kids don't get introduced to them at school, don't get a chance to try them out and don't get a chance to pursue a career.

Someone like Graeme Swann basically fluked his way into the game because his dad played cricket. He didn't play at school, and if his dad hadn't been a prolific club cricketer it's plausible that Swann might never have taken the game up.
This is massive. I've been doing entry-level county cricket sides for six years now and kids in my teams (U10/U11) almost all fall into two distinct categories - either private school boys or boys whose parents / older brothers are cricket badgers. If they don't, then it's almost always because their best mate does.

Looking through the state school boys in this year's U10 squad, their fathers are: Head Coach at Oxford University (with older brother County U12), minor counties team manager at Buckinghamshire (with older brother County U15 B), 2nd team captain at a local club (with older brother County U17), club team manager at another club (with older brother County U12 B). It does rebalance to a degree as the boys get older and you see later developers through clubs and the district system, but we must keep it in mind when we're working at club level or picking rep sides at a younger age - cricket has to be an experience that the able and promising sportsman enjoys and wants to get more from.
 

91Jmay

International Coach
I went to a good independent school, which was famed for sporting dominance in Shropshire, but our cricket team was only really a thing because one teacher player/loved cricket. If he left we wouldn't have had one, and my school is a seriously good sporting school. There are 10 professional footballers who attended the school during the 7 year period I was there but cricket was barely an afterthought.
 

Howe_zat

Audio File
It's not just that people aren't interested. It's that the average person actually hates cricket. Most people in this country just won't understand how you can sit there and watch this game all week.
 

Captain_Cook

U19 12th Man
I'd say he has to work harder for his runs than the likes of Clarke, definitely. It's almost as though each scoring shot requires a full mental review of every lesson he's had since a schoolboy before he executes. Root looks the same so far.
I can't wait until we have a naturally talented batsman! We'll take the world by storm! From what I've seen so far Ian Bell looks very naturally talented, have England had any other naturally talented greats or are they all grafters?

Perhaps that's why they like to open? Less pressure to attempt flamboyant strokes, scoring rate not a consideration? Or maybe they've learned to play within themselves because of their fondness for opening? Chicken/Egg, perhaps.
This is a really interesting take on the topic!

What I would suggest is that Cook is pretty much a one-speed player. I can't say I've ever seen him try to smash the leather off a ball to get the rate up. Perhaps that's a symptom of every single delivery triggering a meticulous and methodical thought process, restricting the time he has to choose a shot and removing all chance of instinct guiding his selection.
The only time I've seen Cook force the issue and succeed was against New Zealand in the Champions Trophy when he scored a quick 60. However, he was dropped three times by his eventual conqueror Nathan McCullum c&b. He was also very aggressive by his test standards in the third innings at Riverside but flirted with a wide one from Harris and was caught for 22. I reckon he may become more instinctual as captaincy take the edge off his concentration but I can't say whether it will be for better or worse. He's still the only captain to score five centuries in his first five tests so that's promising!

It's not just that people aren't interested. It's that the average person actually hates cricket. Most people in this country just won't understand how you can sit there and watch this game all week.
It's the definition of a minority sport because people are very non-committal about their entertainment and can't stand watching a competitive game longer than 90 mins.
 

Adders

Cricketer Of The Year
I can't wait until we have a naturally talented batsman! We'll take the world by storm! From what I've seen so far Ian Bell looks very naturally talented, have England had any other naturally talented greats or are they all grafters?
You ever heard of a bloke by the name of Kevin Pietersen?
 

Captain_Cook

U19 12th Man
You ever heard of a bloke by the name of Kevin Pietersen?
I don't doubt KP's talent but he has the temperament and fire of a South African. I don't think an Englishman would have been so frustrated after tapegate to blast a quick 22 then walk like KP did in the first innings at Riverside. KP is an explosive cricketer who is very similar to Adam Gilchrist in that he can take a match away from you very quickly. However, he can also start brightly and get out.

The kind of cricketer I'm looking for is an English equivalent of Rahul Dravid or Ricky Ponting. I don't know if we have been blessed with a cricketer as good for at least 50 years!
 

91Jmay

International Coach
So one of the best players ever then? I am more than happy with the current crop. They win more than they lose, especially against the Aussies. Good enough for me.
 

MW1304

Cricketer Of The Year
Okay can someone explain something to me. I don't understand the mentality of 'win more than you lose', surely that isn't enough. It's like the phrase 'take more catches than you drop', which to me seems completely ridiculous. If you're only catching just over half of the chances you're getting, that isn't nearly enough. In fact that's a pathetic amount. To me it seems like an inane and completely redundant saying, but you hear it now and again.

This isn't to single you out Jmay, just something that's always baffled me.
 

91Jmay

International Coach
Okay can someone explain something to me. I don't understand the mentality of 'win more than you lose', surely that isn't enough. It's like the phrase 'take more catches than you drop', which to me seems completely ridiculous. If you're only catching just over half of the chances you're getting, that isn't nearly enough. In fact that's a pathetic amount. To me it seems like an inane and completely redundant saying, but you hear it now and again.

This isn't to single you out Jmay, just something that's always baffled me.
Well win more than you lose and catch more than you drop straight away are different things, and you can't compare them. I also didn't say how many more matches England win than they lose. Since Cook has been permanent captain 7 wins to 1 loss with 4 draws. So as my statement was in regards to the current England team, as I said I am more than happy with them. Context is always important, and that was the context of my statement.

Also another example could be Australia. If we take this series and there next two, I'm sure if you asked any Australian fan they would over the 3 series take winning more than they lose because the quality of opposition they face is difficult.
 

MW1304

Cricketer Of The Year
Nah the context isn't the point, which was why I said I wasn't calling you out, it's simply the philosophy of the positive outweighing the negative being satisfactory. Of course the two examples I gave aren't one and the same, but they both encapsulate this idea. I would personally never look at something like 'well as long as we do more good than bad then I'm happy' because, as you say, there's so many different contexts to which it can apply that you can end up doing a heap of things terribly and still justify to yourself that you're doing well enough.
 

grecian

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Little from column a, little from column b.
Indeed, England bats have done really stupidly in the most runs scored, even if they've been quite average over the last 20 years or so, Cook isn't average, and he's playing for England for a long time, he will smash all run-scoring records.
 

ricky8741

Cricket Spectator
This illustrate another aspect that bothers me about Cook. Will he break the records because of his youth or because he is talented?
he has talent not every english batsman can play spin like that. i'am saying that he plays more no of tests matches then odi .he will break more test records.if england plays like 15 test matches a year he can easily score 4- 5 centuries.and being an opener is an added advantage
 

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