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Thread: DoG's Top 100 Test Batsmen - The Top 25

  1. #151
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Furball's Avatar
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    I'm stealing that next time I slag off Kallis.

  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    His highest score should be rated the greatest innings ever, by my calculations.

    DoG to confim.
    This makes me think. Can we get a list of 100 worst test batsmen (that have played 25 tests)?

  3. #153
    International Vice-Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Think that is a bit harsh, if we are going to use that exact argument one could argue a guy with 52 tests should be behind him as well.
    not if that guy averages 99.94 after 52 tests

    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Headley is to me without doubt the most under rated player on CW, considering he is seen by most to be the second best player of his era behind only Bradman and ahed of even Hammond.
    well, it is possible that he was better than hammond. ranking them on par for that era seems to be a fair call anyways. but in the overall scheme of things... I guess I have made my point already

  4. #154
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    I've often considered him if anything to be over-rated because of the quality of bowlers he faced not quite matching up to the reputations of the teams he played against.

    Still not sure why strike rate should have a huge effect either personally - a game lasts 5 days.
    Headley faced Grimmett, Ironmonger, Verity, Rhodes, Allen and Voce, missing only Larwood, whose test record was comparable to Allen's and Voce's, and O'Reilly. Headley also doubled as the defacto opener for his team and never benefitted from any middle order support of note that most other ATG batsman had the luxury of. Headley also never had the fortune to play againts any of the monnows of his time during his prime that Hammond and Bradman took full advantage of and only played agints the top two teams of his era playing both of them away from home as well.

    An attractive free flowing batsman, who was said to be more attractive and better to watch than Bradman who bore the sole responsibility of keeping a poor batting line up and team competitive, thus his name, Atlas. Once he fell the fight was over, and he and his opponents knew it. He was the first player in the West Indies to challenge the rule that white man bat and black man bowl and our first great batsman and still seens as the equal to Sobers, Richards and Lara in our pantheon.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3


  5. #155
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagapath View Post
    not if that guy averages 99.94 after 52 tests



    well, it is possible that he was better than hammond. ranking them on par for that era seems to be a fair call anyways. but in the overall scheme of things... I guess I have made my point already
    Do you mean to say that he is a case like Barry Richards?
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

    Yeah we don't crap in the first world; most of us would actually have no idea what that was emanating from Ajmal's backside. Why isn't it roses and rainbows like what happens here? PEWS's retort to Ganeshran on Daemon's picture depicting Ajmal's excreta

  6. #156
    International Vice-Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Do you mean to say that he is a case like Barry Richards?
    no. i think headley deserves to be placed in a different bracket from barry since he maintained his excellent average over several years even though the number of matches he got to participate in those years was small. with changing bowling line-ups and different batting conditions maintaining such a high average is a great achievement indeed. but remember, Len Hutton averaged 61 after playing 70 tests. his career was split by the second world war. after a break of six years, he resumed his stellar career, played all over the world, for a long time, in changing conditions, against different opponents and yet managed to keep scoring at the best average in history bar bradman. doing the same over 22 tests is a much easier task. that is why i think headley should be ranked below gavaskar, border etc who scored at 50+ for 100 odd tests in at least 5 different countries against three generations of bowlers.

  7. #157
    International Vice-Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    are we missing some other batsman? do you think headley is not on this list at all?

  8. #158
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    By end of Sanga's career many will have. If played as a pure batsman from the start would have been averaging 62-64 by now and would have been considered only second to Bradman at #3
    Don't think would have made a difference and also don't believe that he would have been rated above the likes of Headley, Hammond, Ponting and Richards.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spark View Post
    I don't think it's "slow" that gets up people's nerves. It's being one-paced, not adapting to the match situation.
    Agree, take no risks and play for yourself regardless of the situation. Barrington was actually dropped once for scoring too slowly.

    Additionally it's considerably easier to leave everything alone and place pressure on your team mates to score than to take on the bowlers and make things easier for your teams mates and in the preocess turn the tide of a game or just take it over completely.

    There is a reason people rate Viv over Barrington dispite the numbers and likewise Ponting, Lara and Tendulkar over Dravid and Kallis.

  9. #159
    International Captain ankitj's Avatar
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    Headley basically did **** all after returning to cricket post WWII. So I don't get what it is about him maintaining high standards over a long time. He did not do that.
    marc71178 likes this.

  10. #160
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    The first 10 years of his career still counts for a long time, especually playing tests as rarely as he did.

  11. #161
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    Neither Hammond or Headley should've returned to test cricket after the war. Bradman was the only one of the three who was anywhere near the batsman he was before the war.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sean View Post
    Gavaskar going now also means that - as far as this study is concerned - the top three Test openers of all time are English.
    Something I whole heartedly agree with.
    Last edited by Coronis; 13-08-2013 at 05:13 PM.
    ATG World XI
    1. J.B Hobbs 2. H. Sutcliffe 3. D.G Bradman 4. W.R Hammond 5. G.S Sobers 6. M.J Procter 7. A.C Gilchrist 8. M.D Marshall 9. S.K Warne 10. M. Muralitharan 11. G.D McGrath

  12. #162
    International Vice-Captain Riggins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    The first 10 years of his career still counts for a long time, especually playing tests as rarely as he did.
    I don't really have an opinion on it either way, but you can't up someone for - maintaining their average, " especially playing not very many games. " - maybe despite playing rarely, but even then.
    The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament.

  13. #163
    International Vice-Captain Days of Grace's Avatar
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    16. Ken Barrington (England) (1955-1968)




    Career Length (Days): 4795
    Percentage of team's matches played: 65%
    Career Average: 58.67
    Adjusted career average: 55.52
    Adjusted away average: 61.45 (rank 4)
    Adjusted top-opposition average: 50.93
    Top Tier centuries: 0
    Second tier centuries: 7
    Third tier centuries: 9
    Significant innings: 32
    Significant innings per match: 0.39

    Great innings: 0

    Innings worth average: 3.66

    25 Test peak adjusted average: 71.50 (1964-1967) (rank 10)
    50 Test peak adjusted average: 59.34 (1961-1968)

    Quality Points: 639 (rank 10)
    Career Points: 65
    Peak Points: 140
    TOTAL POINTS: 844


    Despite averaging 58.67 and a monumental 69.18 away from home (which have been adjusted down to 55.52 and 61.45 respectively) Barrington does not find a place in the top 10. One of the reasons is that he never played a great innings. He also scored a lot of runs in high scoring draws which were almost the norm in test cricket in the 1960s. Also, in 15 matches against top-tier opposition, Barrington only averaged 36.14 (adjusted up from 32.14) with no centuries. He was dropped from the England side in the 1950s, eliminated almost all risk from his game, and returned in the 1960s to dominate a somewhat dull, slow-scoring era in English cricket. He is a product of his times. But he is still one of the top 20 batsmen of all time. And Kenny would be happy with that.
    Last edited by Days of Grace; 13-08-2013 at 09:43 PM.
    Greatest Ever Test XI: JB Hobbs, L Hutton, DG Bradman (c), IVA Richards, BC Lara, GS Sobers, AC Gilchrist (wk), Imran Khan, RJ Hadlee, MD Marshall, SK Warne 12th man: M Muralitharan


    Favorite XI: WG Grace, VT Trumper, IVA Richards, DCS Compton, FMM Worrell (c), AC Gilchrist (wk), CL Cairns, SK Warne, FS Trueman, SE Bond, T Richardson 12th man: H Larwood

  14. #164
    Hall of Fame Member NUFAN's Avatar
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    Wow. No top tier centuries, no great innings sounds like a soulless accumulator who is lucky to be so high.
    hendrix and kyear2 like this.

  15. #165
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    kyear to jizz
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Jeets doesn't really deserve to be bowling.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Well yeah Tendy is probably better than Bradman, but Bradman was 70 years ago, if he grew up in the modern era he'd still easily be the best. Though he wasn't, can understand the argument for Tendy even though I don't agree.
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