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**Official** New Zealand Domestic Season 2013/2014

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Yeah, especially given that Otago has a current blackcap bowling for them. Tbf, it was a pretty chancy innings from Johnston - he was slicing Wagner through the slips and gully on a fairly regular basis.

Brownlie was pretty luck to get his 52. Was dropped in the slips off Wagner pretty early on in his innings. The fact that he got out in the exact same way as he did in the first innings in Auckland - with a lazy, leaden-footed on drive that missed completely - won't help his case either. Redmond now with a chance to put more doubt in the selectors' minds.
 
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Kippax

Cricketer Of The Year
Haha Laughlin. Lateral movement is unfair against all NZ teams. Consciously trying to do crazy baseball pitcher stuff with it is even worse.
 

Flem274*

123/5
Fulton and Redmond tonning up together would be the best thing ever. The fans of the opposition would be so horrified and I love it when blokes who are universally written off do well*

*Devcich excepted
 

hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
actually thought Redmond should've been given more of a go at test cricket, could've averaged low 30s which really would've been all we were gonna get.

But definitely an opener. No way should he be anywhere near the middle order.
 

Flem274*

123/5
Redmond has batted all over tbf. He was a successful number three for a while before moving up to open. He's in good nick so if he continues to dominate bringing him in at three for one test isn't the worst plan. While I don't think KW should be above question because he's The Chosen One of his generation, he deserves his place on merit after his successful tour just gone and his average of 43 since the Colombo victory. Because of that, we're looking for a guy to fill in and an experienced FC batsman going through an 18 month hot streak is a good selection. I'm not sure if I would do it but I would consider it.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Yeah, he bore the brunt of a Martin Crowe tizzy at the end of an especially **** 12 months of test cricket for the test side. Not sure if he would've made it in the longer term, but given that he hit an attractive and aggressive 50 in his last test (albeit on a typical Adelaide seamy road) he probably deserved the benefit of the doubt.
 

Flem274*

123/5
The shot he played to end his test career was truly awful. It was one of those shots which stick in the mind and selectors like to make an example of players who do that. I can't remember what I thought at the time but sending a "you may suck but don't go wasting your knocks like that" message to every batsman in the country is a fair move.
 

hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
I wasn't that knowledgeable of the nitty gritty back then; was Crowe actually involved with the side then? Or else how did he have that much influence?
 

hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
"you may suck but don't go wasting your knocks like that" message to every batsman in the country is a fair move.
No it's not. It's cutting off your nose to spite your face. I'm sure there's noone more disappointed in a case like that than the batsman.

More importantly, it's just simply not relevant; you pick your players most likely to succeed. That's it. You don't make selections to send a message.

They did that with Jeetan Patel and they got Bruce Martin. Brilliant.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
No it's not. It's cutting off your nose to spite your face. I'm sure there's noone more disappointed in a case like that than the batsman.

More importantly, it's just simply not relevant; you pick your players most likely to succeed. That's it. You don't make selections to send a message.

They did that with Jeetan Patel and they got Bruce Martin. Brilliant.
Crowe wasn't involved in the side, but he was very vocal in the media about it afterwards, and the media have always tended to parrot his opinions on test cricket, so it lead to Redmond's retention becoming untenable pretty quick.

Spot on about Jeets.
 

Flem274*

123/5
It's a very valid tactic, and Jeets had it coming to him for both his poor bowling and his running away. Bruce Martin deserved his chance, in fact he has a better first class record than Jeets. Martin's failure when his selection was merited does not make Jeets dropping wrong. You want your best players in the team and part of being one of the best players is how you go about it, and running away from a fast bowler when even Chris Martin gets in behind it is a cricketing flaw which is unforgivable. It's backing down and giving up, and not showing the little kiwi fight we apparently have from birth.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Fully disagree about the running away being justification for his axing. As his FC figures show, he's normally a perfectly handy lower order bat - and I'd never seen him play anything like that before. Whatever induced that batting brain melt, a few bad efforts against by-far the most intimidating bowling attack in world cricket, in a tour typified by spineless batting (including his lower order compatriots) shouldn't have been an axing offence. And I don't think Hesson believed that either. He obviously still considered Patel to be in the mix when he picked him for the A match v England, despite the widespread talk that he wasn't coping too well after his mum's death.

As for his bowling, he did no worse than Dan has on past tours of SA, and he would've had much better figures against India and SL with more support from his close in fielders (and a bit more favour from the umpires). In the end it's a bit of a moot point, as due to his mother's death there was no way that Jeets was in the right space to play the test series against England anyway, and Martin deserved continued selection after his form in the first 2 and a half tests.
 
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Kippax

Cricketer Of The Year
I wasn't that knowledgeable of the nitty gritty back then; was Crowe actually involved with the side then? Or else how did he have that much influence?
Sky dangled Crowe out the window for his references to personality traits, as Cribb might caution me about. They demanded he get on board with the less judgemental 'light summer viewing' direction they wanted to take with cricket.

Crowe raises bat to new era - cricket - sport | Stuff.co.nz

Cricket legend Martin Crowe – the most brutal critic of the Black Caps during the doomed five-year reign of coach John Bracewell – today buries the hatchet and makes a plea for fans to get behind the team ahead of the first West Indies test on Thursday.

And Crowe has led from the front, like he did in his 77 tests for the Caps, in an effort to heal the wounds and right the fallout from the disastrous recent series in Australia.

On Friday, he took the unusual step of apologising for comments about opener Aaron Redmond – who was dropped from international duty yesterday.

Earlier, Crowe, left, had said Redmond "never was a test player and never will be''.

Pulling no punches, he told Radio Sport: "You have to pick players that make good decisions.

"While Redmond got an 80 on a very good Adelaide pitch, he continues to have brain explosions ... he’s just too loose.

"I don't see him with the technique to bat long periods. I'm not sure he has the nous, the intelligence, to work it through.

"We have to move on from Redmond."

But Crowe has apologised and retracted his attack on Redmond.

"I'm pretty disappointed in some of things I said and I want to make an apology," Crowe said.

"(My assessment of him was) uncalled for given how tough test cricket is and he has only been in it for less than 12 months. So, I want to retract what I said. I wish him well."

Crowe New Zealand's greatest batsman has been inspired by recent decisions by New Zealand Cricket, including putting new coach Andy Moles into the job in time for this week's test against the West Indies in Dunedin and the inclusion of John Wright on the selection panel.

And last night Crowe was happy with changes made to the team ahead of the tests, which saw Auckland opener Tim McIntosh brought in with allrounders Jacob Oram and James Franklin and quick Mark Gillespie.

"Everything has fallen into place due to strong, clever and decisive leadership from Justin Vaughan and his men," Crowe said in his only newspaper interview.

"The team selected for the first test is a ripper. Batsmen like McIntosh in the form of his life and quickies like Gillespie charging in fit and strong, is fantastic news.

"With Jake Oram back fit too and Brendon McCullum finding form in Adelaide, the team now have, with the skipper and the return of James Franklin, the most explosive multi-talented allrounders in the game.

"This lower order is arguably the strongest NZ has ever selected.

"Add in the number of different but very talented lefthanders in Daniel Flynn and Jesse Ryder to compliment Jamie How and Ross Taylor and you really feel the selectors are on the money.

"There is a powerful look to the whole squad and, along with a smaller support group, these men will prosper in this series and going forward. The future is onwards and upwards.

"All of us in the Sky team are excited with the prospects and can't wait for the first ball in Dunedin on Thursday."
 
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hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
1. He wasn't running away, he was backing away to try and hit through the offside. The recognised batsmen had failed so I don't see how him trying out a tailender's method should warrant criticism.

2. He's a bowler, and not even a recognised "can bat" bowler. I suppose we should drop Southee for his fairly regular village slogs?

3. Kiwi fight is bull****.

4. He'd been our best spinner in India, didn't pick up wickets in SL but was very tight and certainly wasn't a liability like Bracewell was (or Wagner in the WIndies, etc).

5. If you want to replace him with a bowler with a better average, recognise that there are no spinners demanding selection and pick a quick bowler. The selection of Bruce Martin, a bowler who wasn't even in good form, is undeniably a slap in the face. It can't have been expected to produce better results, just to send a message. A message to whom?

"Dear spin bowlers,

If your batsmen fail to set you defendable totals, you will be made a scapegoat.

Cheers,

NZC"
 

wellAlbidarned

International Coach
The shot he played to end his test career was truly awful. It was one of those shots which stick in the mind and selectors like to make an example of players who do that. I can't remember what I thought at the time but sending a "you may suck but don't go wasting your knocks like that" message to every batsman in the country is a fair move.
brendon_mccullum_3957848284.jpg
 

Flem274*

123/5
I don't see how he was backing away to hit through the offside when he was closer to the boundary rope than the ball.

Redmond and Jeets only have themselves to blame for their droppings. Yes, everyone deserves a fair chance. Redmond and Jeets had a fair chance in their most recent recalls. Jeets had many chances. If you're in last chance saloon and you run away to square leg, I have no sympathy. Ingram was dropped after being run out twice because the selectors didn't rate him and couldn't wait for him to fail. Nethula got the yips on debut and was given the flick as fast as possible. Andre Adams and Michael Mason were boring. Taylor lost the captaincy because he wasn't the coaches mate. When you compare their axings to the extended (and in Jeets case multiple) opportunities the above two were provided, and how they treated their final chances, they deserved what they got. If you are batting for a draw you do not go aerial second ball of the day. If you are a tailender you get in behind the ball like Chris Martin does.

And ftr McCullum should have been out the door as soon as he spooned that shot to the outfielder in the first test in Sri Lanka right before the close of play. Some plays are unforgivable. Some marriages fail over a long period of time before the pair just give up, but sometimes someone does the dirty and it's an immediate walk out.

I've given up on hoping for him to ever be dropped.
 

Flem274*

123/5
What do Australians even think of Laughlin? I'm going to assume he's at least not terrible/bowling equivalent of Borgas, though bowling to Wellington can be quite flattering sometimes.
 

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