Go Back   Cricket Web > Cricket Discussion > Cricket Chat



Finding Seams on Apples - Order Your Copy!


View Poll Results: Most important captaincy credential
Field placement/tactics 7 24.14%
Man-management/personal leadership 15 51.72%
Their personal performances 2 6.90%
Usman Khawaja is a negative influence on the squad 5 17.24%
Voters: 29. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-04-2013, 05:48 AM   #1 (permalink)
International Captain
 
LongHopCassidy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: www.edcowan.com
Posts: 5,055
What do you value in a captain?

Interesting question, which seems very divisive on CW.

Obviously it's easy to tell between a good captain and a bad one, but what facet of them do you notice the most? Inspired fields? The loyalty of your team? Leading by example with bat or ball?

Discuss.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by howardj View Post
A bloke you'd want to go into the trenches with and have a grog with.

A grog in the trenches.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FaaipDeOiad View Post
You actually are John Howard, aren't you?
RIP Fardin Qayyumi and Craig Walsh - true icons of CricketWeb.

Last edited by LongHopCassidy; 06-04-2013 at 05:49 PM.
LongHopCassidy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 06:08 AM   #2 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Pune, India
Posts: 816
Ideally in a captain you'd want all three.
But for me, a captain's got to have the force of personality and ability to instill the belief to win in a bunch of guys, especially if the team doesn't have too many exceptional individual cricketers. In a team filled with stars, obviously man-management becomes essential.
I certainly don't agree with the opinion that "The best player should be captain... find that to be incredibly silly". really think it's a specialized job which not everyone is perfectly suited for, which is why if he's an inspirational leader and manages the team well, he should be good enough to hold his place in the squad... anything more from him in terms of personal performances is a bonus.
Satyanash89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 08:22 AM   #3 (permalink)
Cricketer Of The Year
 
Pothas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Surbiton, UK
Posts: 8,453
Well we normally want what we do not currently have so as an England fan it would be really nice to see a captain with bold and inventive field placing and tactics. You have to say though, that the thing that really stands out with successful captains in recent years has been their leadership. Not many have them have been what you would describe as inspirational but you would say they were all good leaders.

Wider question though is how important are captains these days? They quite clearly still play an integral role but I would reckon that we would have seen a bigger change in the way England play if it was Flower that had left rather than Strauss.
Pothas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 09:07 AM   #4 (permalink)
Global Moderator
 
Prince EWS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New South Wales
Posts: 37,728
One of the top two. I voted for field placing and tactics mainly because I think it separates the good captains from the middle of the road captains, but you're going to be a completely rubbish captain if you have poor leadership. I think there's basically a minimum standard of leadership ability required, and from those who meet that standard you go with the bloke who's the best tactically.

Personal performance doesn't really come into it as a standalone factor at all. I think it helps on the leadership front; it's easier to lead if you can do it from the front, and it's a lot harder to get players to get behind you if they don't think you command your place, but it's more of a sub-factor for the second option IMO.
__________________
~ Cribbage
Prince EWS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 11:24 AM   #5 (permalink)
Hall of Fame Member
 
smalishah84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: dxb
Posts: 18,860
I think once you are able to ensure that you are good enough to be selected in the best XI of the country then I think the most important thing because man management and motivating the players since then your own place in the team is not in question. All the good captains that I have seen have over the years have commanded that sense of loyalty/give-it-all feeling from their players which is what gives the team real character IMO
__________________
And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

Yeah we don't crap in the first world; most of us would actually have no idea what that was emanating from Ajmal's backside. Why isn't it roses and rainbows like what happens here? PEWS's retort to Ganeshran on Daemon's picture depicting Ajmal's excreta
smalishah84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 11:28 AM   #6 (permalink)
International Debutant
 
Monk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,568
Field placements and tactics ability- you either have them or you don't. And they don't always go hand in hand with the ability to lead others.

I'd be all for having two captains in cricket, each with distinct roles. One takes care of on field tactics, and the other is the leader of the team.

Ponting and Steve Waugh were both examples of guys who were good leaders of men, but weren't great tacticians (in my opinion). While Clarke is a great tactician on field, he is possibly struggling to keep order in the house (based on speculation only).

An interesting side conversation would be guys who have managed to combine all the facets of captaincy successfully. From Australia, I'd say the best captain we've had was Ian Chappell. Very good tactically, probably in the top 3 batsmen in the team, and players who played under him all speak of him incredibly highly.

Last edited by Monk; 06-04-2013 at 11:30 AM.
Monk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 12:59 PM   #7 (permalink)
Hall of Fame Member
 
smalishah84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: dxb
Posts: 18,860
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monk View Post
Field placements and tactics ability- you either have them or you don't. And they don't always go hand in hand with the ability to lead others.

I'd be all for having two captains in cricket, each with distinct roles. One takes care of on field tactics, and the other is the leader of the team.

Ponting and Steve Waugh were both examples of guys who were good leaders of men, but weren't great tacticians (in my opinion). While Clarke is a great tactician on field, he is possibly struggling to keep order in the house (based on speculation only).

An interesting side conversation would be guys who have managed to combine all the facets of captaincy successfully. From Australia, I'd say the best captain we've had was Ian Chappell. Very good tactically, probably in the top 3 batsmen in the team, and players who played under him all speak of him incredibly highly.
I didn't see Ian Chappell lead but he is very highly rated indeed.
smalishah84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 01:11 PM   #8 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Pune, India
Posts: 816
Quote:
Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
I didn't see Ian Chappell lead but he is very highly rated indeed.
So that's why half the crap he says in the commentary box begins with "if i was captain..."?
Satyanash89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 01:12 PM   #9 (permalink)
Global Moderator
 
Prince EWS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New South Wales
Posts: 37,728
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satyanash89 View Post
So that's why half the crap he says in the commentary box begins with "if i was captain..."?
Yeah pretty much. He sits there and thinks about the game as if he was the fielding captain. I actually really like that aspect of his commentary tbh.
Prince EWS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 01:30 PM   #10 (permalink)
International Debutant
 
Monk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,568
Most people don't rate Chappeli as a commentator, but I do. Pretty insightful during match commentary. He spouts a lot of crap on his videoblogs and in print, but he knows the game better than almost anyone imo.
Monk is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 04:13 PM   #11 (permalink)
State 12th Man
 
Jnr.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Queensland
Posts: 785
Ed Smith wrote a really good article on this a few days ago. Ed Smith: Why Cook's the right man to lead England | Cricinfo Magazine | ESPN Cricinfo

I prefer great man-management skills, to get the best out of every player in the team. I think that on-field captaincy is over rated.
Jnr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 04:37 PM   #12 (permalink)
International 12th Man
 
Viscount Tom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Leeds, G.O.C.
Posts: 1,635
It depends on the team Darren Sammy's no great strategist or tactician, but he's done what no Windies captain seems to have done for nearly a decade or more and got the team pulling in the same direction.

Some teams are best served having a Sammy some teams are better suited to having a tactician.
__________________
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spark View Post
Please learn how batting works before posting any more on the subject.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ViruTheBest View Post
I already do but clearly many English fans don't. You will be stuck in this vicious cycle until then. Our batting legacy is something other countries could only dream of achieving.
Viscount Tom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 05:39 PM   #13 (permalink)
Request Your Custom Title Now!
 
Jono's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Virat Kohli
Posts: 47,482
Yeah gun post viscount. Depends on the maturity of the team and the politics of the board.
Jono is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 06:15 PM   #14 (permalink)
Cricket Web Staff Member
 
Burgey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Castle
Posts: 35,138
Blokes would walk over broken glass for Chappell. He backed his players to the hilt and was tactically pretty sound as well. Also, his average as skipper increased pretty dramatically UIMM.

Mind you, it helped to have the the pace attack he did. Still, that side of his hot to number one pretty soon after being drubbed by SA then England. And they did it without especially decent opening batsmen too, interestingly enough.
__________________
WWCC - Loyaulte Mi Lie
"People make me happy.. not places.. people"

"When a man is tired of London, he is tired of life." - Samuel Johnson
"Oh my God, there's a castle! A castle!"
Burgey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 06:30 PM   #15 (permalink)
International Debutant
 
Monk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,568
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burgey View Post
Blokes would walk over broken glass for Chappell..
Steve Waugh had a bit of this about him as well. At least with Langer!
Monk is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mushfiqur Rahim named Bangladesh captain BlazeDragon Cricket Chat 3 21-09-2011 04:58 AM
International Cricket Captain Ashes Edition Squirrel General 4 27-06-2011 06:34 PM
Pakistan about to get another new Captain Xuhaib Cricket Chat 60 28-05-2010 02:08 PM
Test Captains- an in-depth look Xuhaib Cricket Chat 5 11-01-2009 05:43 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:12 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright ©2001 - 2011, Cricket Web