View Poll Results: Most important captaincy credential

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  • Field placement/tactics

    7 24.14%
  • Man-management/personal leadership

    15 51.72%
  • Their personal performances

    2 6.90%
  • Usman Khawaja is a negative influence on the squad

    5 17.24%
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Thread: What do you value in a captain?

  1. #16
    Request Your Custom Title Now! benchmark00's Avatar
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    Steve Waugh is no worse a captain than Ian Chappell was. They were both aggressive and both had the cattle to be aggressive.

    Chappell's commentary is rubbish because his only philosophy on captaincy is be aggressive, and any captain who isn't aggressive is a bad captain according to him.

    If he was the captain of a team with a poor pace attack over an extended period of time, if he used his captaincy approach he would almost certainly be a failure. Just because it worked with a great attack doesn't mean it would work with another attack.

    His commentary is also to blame for a large majority of fans thinking Shane Warne would be, or is, a good captain.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    Steve Waugh is no worse a captain than Ian Chappell was. They were both aggressive and both had the cattle to be aggressive.

    Chappell's commentary is rubbish because his only philosophy on captaincy is be aggressive, and any captain who isn't aggressive is a bad captain according to him.

    If he was the captain of a team with a poor pace attack over an extended period of time, if he used his captaincy approach he would almost certainly be a failure. Just because it worked with a great attack doesn't mean it would work with another attack.

    His commentary is also to blame for a large majority of fans thinking Shane Warne would be, or is, a good captain.
    I disagree, Chappell never lost a test series as captain. Waugh had the best Australian team in history yet lost in Sri Lanka and India. He had the best attack in the world yet was clueless several times (he let the Indian team bat an entire day without taking a wicket, allowed teams to chase 300 plus twice and over 400 once).

  3. #18
    International Captain LongHopCassidy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    Steve Waugh is no worse a captain than Ian Chappell was. They were both aggressive and both had the cattle to be aggressive.
    You are a total putz if you think Lillee-Thomson-Walker-Mallett was equal cattle to Warne-McGrath-Gillespie-Lee.
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  4. #19
    International Coach uvelocity's Avatar
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    the most important captaincy credential is that they be a fast bowler. need someone with brains ffs
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  5. #20
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    Chappell's commentary is rubbish because his only philosophy on captaincy is be aggressive, and any captain who isn't aggressive is a bad captain according to him.
    I agree with his aggression philosophy 99% of the time. Every great test series ever has had aggressive captain/s.

  6. #21
    Request Your Custom Title Now! benchmark00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by subshakerz View Post
    I disagree, Chappell never lost a test series as captain. Waugh had the best Australian team in history yet lost in Sri Lanka and India. He had the best attack in the world yet was clueless several times (he let the Indian team bat an entire day without taking a wicket, allowed teams to chase 300 plus twice and over 400 once).
    Yep, it was all Steve Waugh's doing that they lost those matches you speak of. You're definitely right. But it definitely wasnt his doing when they won the most test matches in a row of all time. That was thanks to the players.

    Quote Originally Posted by LongHopCassidy View Post
    You are a total putz if you think Lillee-Thomson-Walker-Mallett was equal cattle to Warne-McGrath-Gillespie-Lee.
    At the time they were. If you're rating the attack head to head, Steve Waugh's team are probably a bit better, but that's not the point, though it's not surprising that you picked that out.

    During Chappell's time as captain he had the premier attack. During Steve Waugh's time, he had the premier attack. Putting 8 slips in place does not mean you're a tactical genius.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    I agree with his aggression philosophy 99% of the time. Every great test series ever has had aggressive captain/s.
    I'm not saying it's not entertaining. As fans we all want to see captains be aggressive, but that's not always the best way to skin a cat.

  8. #23
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    I'm not saying it's not entertaining. As fans we all want to see captains be aggressive, but that's not always the best way to skin a cat.
    I can see your point, but Chappell did have a team made to be captained aggressively. If you have that team, you captain aggressively.

    For mine, I can rarely see any point in not being aggressive as a captain (in test cricket). In the field you always have to want wickets. As soon as the slips start coming out, and the field gets pushed back, the batsman know they're on top. You have to back your bowlers to do their job with aggressive/positive field placements etc.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    Yep, it was all Steve Waugh's doing that they lost those matches you speak of. You're definitely right. But it definitely wasnt his doing when they won the most test matches in a row of all time. That was thanks to the players.


    The Chappell era was before my time, so can someone here explain why he's considered one of the greatest captains. Was he himself an ultra-aggressive captain who was 100% attack-minded all the time. If so, I can forgive his commentary partly because he's atleast not being hypocritical when criticizing other captains for going even slightly on the defensive

  10. #25
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satyanash89 View Post

    can someone here explain why he's considered one of the greatest captains.
    Captaincy by Ian Chappell

  11. #26
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    [QUOTE=benchmark00;3050402]Yep, it was all Steve Waugh's doing that they lost those matches you speak of. You're definitely right. But it definitely wasnt his doing when they won the most test matches in a row of all time. That was thanks to the players.[QUOTE]

    Um, shouldnt you judge a captain by their record?

    Steve Waugh had a side that was overwhelmingly superior to any other side in the world. The only real challenge for him was to win a series in tough territory like the subcontinent, yet he lost in both Sri Lanka and India. So yeah, it does reflect on his captaincy.

    And since the captain is most influential on the field, I do think the fact that he let a team bat a whole day without getting a wicket, and allow teams to chase 300 twice and 400 once indicates that his on-the-field captaincy wasnt all that great. If it happens once that can be an exception maybe. I cant imagine a great captain allowing that with an all-time great bowling attack.

    And Ricky Pointing also won the most test matches in a row, you might remember, but once he lost his star players, the team declinded rapidly. Few in any consider him a great captain.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by subshakerz View Post

    Um, shouldnt you judge a captain by their record?
    No.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    I can see your point, but Chappell did have a team made to be captained aggressively. If you have that team, you captain aggressively.

    For mine, I can rarely see any point in not being aggressive as a captain (in test cricket). In the field you always have to want wickets. As soon as the slips start coming out, and the field gets pushed back, the batsman know they're on top. You have to back your bowlers to do their job with aggressive/positive field placements etc.
    Your first paragraph - absolutely. I'm not saying Chappell was a bad captain at all. His unwillingness to concede that that's not always the best method in commentary is what frustrates me.

    Second part, I'll respond late. NMFC are playing ffs.

  14. #29
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    NMFC are playing ffs.
    Probably the best reason I can think of to be posting on cricketweb.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by benchmark00 View Post
    No.
    If you are talking about simple win-loss, ratio, I agree with you. But if you are talking about achievements (like winning a world cup, or defeating a superior opponent or like that) I disagree.

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