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**Official English County Cricket 2013**
- Thread starter theegyptian
- Start date
theegyptian
International Vice-Captain
Think Carberry's knock was put into some kind of perspective by Lancashire so nearly chasing the score down, good though it was.
Difference for me imo were the spinners on both teams. Briggs and Dawson are very decent spinners in t20 cricket, Kerrigan and Lilley just a notch or two down. Kerrigan is a funny one because he is a distinctly average short form bowler and yet dominates in first class cricket. Lancs definitely missed Parry. Kerrigan made the lions one day team last winter in Australia having only played 3 40 over and 0 T20 games in the 2012 CC season. Played a bit more this season but still been poor by and large. Hopefully England learned their lesson and Kerrigan doesn't get the callup to these lions 50 over games against Bangladesh.
Gotta be looking at Briggs, Rafiq, Parry(if fit) or maybe Ravi Patel.
I've said it before but I'm really worried for England once Swann retires. Kerrigan maybe the man in tests but otherwise there aren't many great talents around the circuit at present. Panesar is off his rocker, and will compete with Kerrigan for the tests but otherwise there isn't much.
Whoever England pick for the lions games the counties aren't going to be happy. You're gonna have a few like Stokes and Carberry who maybe getting callups to the full T20 and ODI side whilst presumabley playing for the lions a week or so earlier. You'd hope they'd name the lions, england odi, t20 teams together so there is little or no crossover but the lions games go on whilst the 5th test is being played so it's unlikely that they're going to know who they want to rest from the test team for the odi's
My Lions team to play Bangladesh a in 3 50 over games.
Carberry, Hales, Taylor, Ballance, Patel, Stokes, Kieswetter, fast bowlers, Briggs
Bowlers could be anyone.
Take the ones that went on the ill fated lions tour last winter
Coles- Disciplined and terrible this season
Harris- Injured for most of this season. Played 2nd team game today with TRJ
Meaker- Injured for most of this season, still rehabing
Overton- Season long stress fracture
TRJ- See Harris
Topley- Done ok
Wright- out for the seaon with a stress fracture
Coincidence? or too much workload or something? Nearly all went to india earlier in the winter as well
Anyway gonna need to pick someone. I'd guess Willey, Topley, Jordan(if he wants), Napier/Crook
Crook or Napier are the wrong side of 30 but deserve selection. Slightly pointless if neither is going to play for England to take them away from their counties.
Difference for me imo were the spinners on both teams. Briggs and Dawson are very decent spinners in t20 cricket, Kerrigan and Lilley just a notch or two down. Kerrigan is a funny one because he is a distinctly average short form bowler and yet dominates in first class cricket. Lancs definitely missed Parry. Kerrigan made the lions one day team last winter in Australia having only played 3 40 over and 0 T20 games in the 2012 CC season. Played a bit more this season but still been poor by and large. Hopefully England learned their lesson and Kerrigan doesn't get the callup to these lions 50 over games against Bangladesh.
Gotta be looking at Briggs, Rafiq, Parry(if fit) or maybe Ravi Patel.
I've said it before but I'm really worried for England once Swann retires. Kerrigan maybe the man in tests but otherwise there aren't many great talents around the circuit at present. Panesar is off his rocker, and will compete with Kerrigan for the tests but otherwise there isn't much.
Whoever England pick for the lions games the counties aren't going to be happy. You're gonna have a few like Stokes and Carberry who maybe getting callups to the full T20 and ODI side whilst presumabley playing for the lions a week or so earlier. You'd hope they'd name the lions, england odi, t20 teams together so there is little or no crossover but the lions games go on whilst the 5th test is being played so it's unlikely that they're going to know who they want to rest from the test team for the odi's
My Lions team to play Bangladesh a in 3 50 over games.
Carberry, Hales, Taylor, Ballance, Patel, Stokes, Kieswetter, fast bowlers, Briggs
Bowlers could be anyone.
Take the ones that went on the ill fated lions tour last winter
Coles- Disciplined and terrible this season
Harris- Injured for most of this season. Played 2nd team game today with TRJ
Meaker- Injured for most of this season, still rehabing
Overton- Season long stress fracture
TRJ- See Harris
Topley- Done ok
Wright- out for the seaon with a stress fracture
Coincidence? or too much workload or something? Nearly all went to india earlier in the winter as well
Anyway gonna need to pick someone. I'd guess Willey, Topley, Jordan(if he wants), Napier/Crook
Crook or Napier are the wrong side of 30 but deserve selection. Slightly pointless if neither is going to play for England to take them away from their counties.
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theegyptian
International Vice-Captain
ohh apparently there is now a lions v australia 2 day game between the fourth and fifth test. Was going to be Northants but they're in t20 finals day which is being played on the 2nd day of this lions game.
The fixture schedule is just ridiculous. Some of these guys are gonna be at breaking point.
The fixture schedule is just ridiculous. Some of these guys are gonna be at breaking point.
theegyptian
International Vice-Captain
yes the schedule just doesn't allow fast bowlers to play all the formats. Look at Barker at warwickshire. Played a couple of t20's for warwickshire because there was no-else available to play but didn't bowl(or bat for that matter - sorry he did bat) because they didn't want him to risk his fitness or ruin his red ball skills. J Overton basically rested from T20 and 40 over cricket to allow him to play first class cricket. The best bowlers will always play the first class games first and foremost and be rested from t20 and 40 over games with the schedule as it is.
The lions are a great idea but in the english summer they just clog up an already immensely complicated and busy schedule. But what can you do? I guess it's a reciprocal deal with other boards. Lions went to Bang a couple of years ago, so have to return the favour.
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Cabinet96
Global Moderator
It's not just the schedule though, it's a factor yes, but it's far from the full story. Fact is, most of England's back up seamers in the test side just don't have the tools to be good ODI bowlers. Finn is the only person outside of the test line up who is a really good ODI bowler. You could argue that the schedule means they turn into more FC specialists, but the limitations they have in the short format are all pretty natural ones IMO. Either too skiddy (Meaker, Onions) or too slow (Tremlett, TRJ) or even both (Woakes). Now you could argue all of the first four could improve significantly by developing one day tools, such as slower balls, more variations in length etc, which is your point I guess. But none of them are natural limited overs bowlers.
It really hinders England as an ODI side, as people are always wanting the big guns to get rested etc, but the replacements just aren't up to it.
It's a massive contrast to Australia funnily enough. Of their five frontline quicks in the Ashes, squad, only Starc will likely make the ODI squad (although Harris has basically had his ODI career ended by fitness issues, not a lack of ability). Means they can give rest to all their best test bowlers, and reel in replacements such as McKay, Johnson, Faulkner and Doherty and not hinder their side. I wouldn't be surprised if Australia win the ODI series, not because they're strongest XI is better than ours, but simply because Anderson and Broad won't play the whole series.
On another note, I think Graeme Swann's ODI career is done. No spring chicken anymore, and Tredwell has shown himself to be a much more than adequate replacement. I think England should really be trying to get Briggs into their limited overs set up as well. With Swann's recurring elbow, and the fact that he's had several other injuries of late, I just think there's no point him playing in coloured clothing anymore (maybe T20's). And I think the English establishment are starting to agree (reckon he just wasn't selected for the CT knockouts, not injured).
It really hinders England as an ODI side, as people are always wanting the big guns to get rested etc, but the replacements just aren't up to it.
It's a massive contrast to Australia funnily enough. Of their five frontline quicks in the Ashes, squad, only Starc will likely make the ODI squad (although Harris has basically had his ODI career ended by fitness issues, not a lack of ability). Means they can give rest to all their best test bowlers, and reel in replacements such as McKay, Johnson, Faulkner and Doherty and not hinder their side. I wouldn't be surprised if Australia win the ODI series, not because they're strongest XI is better than ours, but simply because Anderson and Broad won't play the whole series.
On another note, I think Graeme Swann's ODI career is done. No spring chicken anymore, and Tredwell has shown himself to be a much more than adequate replacement. I think England should really be trying to get Briggs into their limited overs set up as well. With Swann's recurring elbow, and the fact that he's had several other injuries of late, I just think there's no point him playing in coloured clothing anymore (maybe T20's). And I think the English establishment are starting to agree (reckon he just wasn't selected for the CT knockouts, not injured).
the big bambino
International Captain
Gets called medium fast on cricnfo probably on account of his age rather than where he tickles the speed gun.
the big bambino
International Captain
Bit of a strange juxtaposition criticising Tremlett for being slow while envying us McKay and Faulkner.
the big bambino
International Captain
Fair enough. I like Faulkner's attitude. Doesn't back off and might accumulate a few fines in his career. Not good enough for tests yet but should play odis frequently.
marc71178
Eyes not spreadsheets
Why exactly? Is he really likely to do better than Bell has done?
I am not worried about spinners when Swann retires. Kerrigan looks a good CC bowler from what i've seen and heard, and limited overs wise Tredwell will be around for a while with Ravi Patel, Javid, Rafiq and Briggs all being good prospects.
I see absolutely no value in picking Samit for the Lions team anymore. He clearly is exactly what he is, not going to get any better. I'd go Carberry, Hales, Taylor, Ballance, Trego, Stokes, Kieswetter, Rankin, Finn, Willey, Briggs
I see absolutely no value in picking Samit for the Lions team anymore. He clearly is exactly what he is, not going to get any better. I'd go Carberry, Hales, Taylor, Ballance, Trego, Stokes, Kieswetter, Rankin, Finn, Willey, Briggs
Luke Wright (Sussex, captain), Gary Ballance (Yorkshire), Danny Briggs (Hampshire), Jos Buttler (Somerset), Michael Carberry (Hampshire), Chris Jordan (Sussex), Jamie Overton (Somerset), Boyd Rankin (Warwickshire), Ben Stokes (Durham), James Taylor (Nottinghamshire), James Vince (Hampshire), David Willey (Northamptonshire).
That is the official squad. Quite happy with that actually, I'd leave Overton out and go:
Vince, Carberry, Taylor, Ballance, Stokes, Wright, Buttler, Willey, Jordan, Rankin, Briggs.
That is the official squad. Quite happy with that actually, I'd leave Overton out and go:
Vince, Carberry, Taylor, Ballance, Stokes, Wright, Buttler, Willey, Jordan, Rankin, Briggs.
theegyptian
International Vice-Captain
haha maybe they're going back to kieswetter for england odi team.
theegyptian
International Vice-Captain
Hampshire and Sussex are the two teams with no first class cricket whilst these lions games are going on so it makes sense that there are 5 players from these teams. Forgot Rankin was alive.