View Poll Results: Who is the worst wicket keeper to play 75 Tests as designated keeper?

Voters
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  • MV Boucher (ICC/SA)

    3 10.34%
  • IA Healy (Aus)

    1 3.45%
  • AC Gilchrist (Aus)

    0 0%
  • RW Marsh (Aus)

    0 0%
  • APE Knott (Eng)

    1 3.45%
  • TG Evans (Eng)

    1 3.45%
  • SMH Kirmani (India)

    2 6.90%
  • AJ Stewart (Eng)

    5 17.24%
  • Wasim Bari (Pak)

    0 0%
  • PJL Dujon (WI)

    1 3.45%
  • MS Dhoni (India)

    15 51.72%
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Thread: Who is the worst wicket keeper to play 75 Tests as designated keeper

  1. #1
    SJS
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    Who is the worst wicket keeper to play 75 Tests as designated keeper

    Who is the worst wicket keeper ever to play 75 test matches (as designated keeper). Here is the list of those who have reached this figure.

    Code:
    Player (Country)	Span         	Mat
    
    MV Boucher (ICC/SA)	1997-2012	147
    IA Healy (Aus)   	1988-1999	119
    AC Gilchrist (Aus)	1999-2008	96
    RW Marsh (Aus)        	1970-1984	96
    APE Knott (Eng)        	1967-1981	95
    TG Evans (Eng)         	1946-1959	91
    SMH Kirmani (India)	1976-1986	88
    AJ Stewart (Eng)	1991-2003	82
    Wasim Bari (Pak)	1967-1984	81
    PJL Dujon (WI)  	1982-1991	79
    MS Dhoni (India)	2005-2013	75
    Last edited by SJS; 05-03-2013 at 12:18 AM.

  2. #2
    SJS
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    Oops I missed the poll :o(

    Can anyone help to add one with these eleven names as options?

  3. #3
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Spikey's Avatar
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    you have to make a new thread
    Indians can't bowl - Where has the rumour come from as I myself and many indian friends arwe competent fast bowlers ?

    With the English bid I said: Let us be brief. If you give back the Falkland Islands, which belong to us, you will get my vote. They then became sad and left

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    This looks suspiciously like a "lets all beat up on Dhoni" thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Jeets doesn't really deserve to be bowling.
    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Well yeah Tendy is probably better than Bradman, but Bradman was 70 years ago, if he grew up in the modern era he'd still easily be the best. Though he wasn't, can understand the argument for Tendy even though I don't agree.
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  5. #5
    International Vice-Captain Red Hill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS View Post
    Who is the worst wicket keeper ever to play 75 test matches (as designated keeper). Here is the list of those who have reached this figure.

    Code:
    Player (Country)	Span         	Mat
    
    MV Boucher (ICC/SA)	1997-2012	147
    IA Healy (Aus)   	1988-1999	119
    AC Gilchrist (Aus)	1999-2008	96
    RW Marsh (Aus)        	1970-1984	96
    APE Knott (Eng)        	1967-1981	95
    TG Evans (Eng)         	1946-1959	91
    SMH Kirmani (India)	1976-1986	88
    AJ Stewart (Eng)	1991-2003	82
    Wasim Bari (Pak)	1967-1984	81
    PJL Dujon (WI)  	1982-1991	79
    MS Dhoni (India)	2005-2013	75
    Not sure about the worst, but for mine the best were Evans, Knott, Kirmani and Healy. I really don't know enough about Wasim Bari to comment.

    Stewart and Boucher were pretty similar, solid enough keepers without being truly great at the craft. Dujon (as is well documented) was great to pace, but rarely got up to the stumps apart from part time offies like Hooper and Viv.

    Interested in people's opinions of Marsh. He was before my time, and you really only see him in footage keeping to Lillee/Thommo. What was he like to spinners?

    Gilly was a really good keeper I reckon. Think he's been underrated at times. Not quite in the same league as Evans, Knott, Kirmani and Healy, but very very good.
    Last edited by Red Hill; 05-03-2013 at 12:56 AM.

  6. #6
    U19 Debutant Biryani Pillow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    Interested in people's opinions of Marsh. He was before my time, and you really only see him in footage keeping to Lillee/Thommo. What was he like to spinners?
    When Marsh first played for Australia he was known as "Irongloves".

    He became a good keeper to pace bowlers - mainly because of his agility - and was, IMO passable, keeping to spinners.

    His best skill there was as a talker.

  7. #7
    International Coach flibbertyjibber's Avatar
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    Stewart was passable as a keeper but wasn't great. Probably be looked upon as a good one these days though standards have dropped so much.

  8. #8
    Hall of Fame Member Howe_zat's Avatar
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    Kamran Akmal played 53 tests, it turns out.
    'It seems that perfection is attained, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing more to take away.'

  9. #9
    SJS
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    This looks suspiciously like a "lets all beat up on Dhoni" thread.
    There is nothing suspicious or underhand about it :o) My views on Dhoni's keeping are well kown. Today in particular and in this match in general he hit a bottom even he had not touched before. Two of the slip catches taken by India were his catches. One hiy his fingers, went down to hit the pad above the knee and bounced upwards to the slip fielder. He had not moved his hands an inch in the direction in which the ball was travelling.

    The other catch did not even hit his gloves since not only did he have his hands at the height the ball was when nicked, he had stood up and the ball hit the pads to again deviate to second slip for an easy catch.

    Yesterday, I think, he had an easy legside catch (as easy as leg side snicks are expected to be and much easier than the one he held today and he grassed it.

    Yes I think he is the worst wicket keeper to play for a country for so long without any challenge to his position as a keeper and this is disgraceful.

    All arguments that are offered giving his batting as an excuse for his place being assured in the side are ridiculous for they demean the role of a wicket keeper completely.

    Yes Dhoni is a batsman of some class inspite of his very unorthodox and unschooled methods but I am a great admirer of that as I am of what he brings to the table as India's skipper. But that does not mean he has to keep wickets as well.

    He should be playing for india as a batsman and lead the side. I think even with his overall modest record at Test level his batting plus his great value as captain justifies his place in this Indian side and even the one that he was leading three years ago.

    What I dio not appreciate is the complete running down of the place of a keeper in the scheme of things.

    I can understand someone wanting to include Gilchrist in an all time great side for Gilchrist, though not the equal of the best ever was a very good wicket keeper indeed. Dhoni is unlikely to be amongst the best five wicket keepers in India.

    The problem with wicket keepers is that you dont ever get to know how good they are at junior and even first class levels these days. You can look at someone's batting average of fifty plus in the Ranji trophy and say it is because the wickets are doped, bowling standards are poor and the top Indian players stay away from ranji trophy. Same can be said to a lesser extent for bowlers. But for wicket keepers the move from a junior to first class to international level does not mean you require better skills. The keeper, unlike the batsman and bowler, is not really engaged in a one-on-one battle within a team game. His job remains the same.

    hence the appreciation of a wicket keeper's quality can only be done by those who understand the craft and sometimes by the bowlers who they keep to.

    Unfortunately, today we are looking at the batting records of keepers to se if they are good enough to move to the next level. Thus so many good keepers have fallen by the way side in India.

    It is true for other countries as well - this emphasis on batting, but the keepers in these countries are expected to be of a minimum level. If not they do not last.

    The worst keeper in that list could have been Alec Stewart, but for Dhoni and the difference between Stewart's keeping and Dhoni is not small. You cant tell because you dont see any good keepers for long competing with Dhoni as they did with Stewart. They showed what is the difference between the two and then a call can be made. But at least the public was made aware of the difference between Stewart and those who were better keepers even if not better or even his equals as batsmen.

    In India, no one mentions Dhoni's poor keeping. When those two snicks were delected by him to the slips it was never mentioned that these were really Dhoni's catches. Just imagine if Australia were not under the kind of pressure that they were and India did not have the close in fielders, these catches would never have been taken.

    How come no one mentions this.

    No this is not a surreptitious way of showing up the worst long term keeper a country has had in the history of the game but to show the over all lack of concern about it in the game.

    Wade is no great keeper but Australia will replace him if they get a better keeper.

    Someone mentioned Marsh's being called 'iron-gloves' for so stiff was he initially and dropped so much. But he improved beyond recognition. Dhoni has shown no improvement whatsoever. How can he when no one even mentions that his keeping needs to improve even if it is considered blasphemy to ask him to leave aside the gloves.

    With so much work load that he has, instead of asking him to drop out from some games, why not ask him to play as a batsman - skipper. His workload will lighten, he will be more relaxed I am sure and we will not have the spectacle of a terrible keeper in a side that wishes to be number one in the world and this man is the captain.

    When Imran found his bowling had declined he bowled less and less. Wilfred Rhodes stopped bowling altogether and played for England purely as a batsman. Whats the big deal.

    The man is a credit to the game as a fighting batsman, a top notch leader of men, a strong and calm individual - why must we also know him as sucj a lousy wicket keeper.

    This is why this thread and this is why the minimum eligibility is 75 Tests :o)

    I do not hide behind suspicious acts :o)

  10. #10
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    yeah....I had opened the thread to vote Kamran Akmal.....pretty sure if the qualification is 50 tests khatmal would win it
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

    Yeah we don't crap in the first world; most of us would actually have no idea what that was emanating from Ajmal's backside. Why isn't it roses and rainbows like what happens here? PEWS's retort to Ganeshran on Daemon's picture depicting Ajmal's excreta

  11. #11
    International Coach social's Avatar
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    Dhoni's keeping in this match was terrible and he was actually outperformed by Wade who has been the subject of so much derision

  12. #12
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by social View Post
    Dhoni's keeping in this match was terrible and he was actually outperformed by Wade who has been the subject of so much derision
    If SJS is to be believed then in that context your statement is a little confusing. Do you mean Wade was worse than Dhoni or was he better than him?

  13. #13
    International Coach social's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    If SJS is to be believed then in that context your statement is a little confusing. Do you mean Wade was worse than Dhoni or was he better than him?
    Dhoni was worse that Wade in this test

  14. #14
    International Debutant ganeshran's Avatar
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    Except that Hughes catch, Dhoni's keeping was rank mediocre in this test

    But Kamran Akmal is on another planet compared to Dhoni. He misses the qualification criteria though/
    Get well soon Yuvi!!

  15. #15
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    Probably Stewart at the bottom of that honours class.

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