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Thread: ***Official*** England in New Zealand series 2013

  1. #391
    International Coach Hurricane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Young View Post
    Had it with Ryder. He can take his talents and attitude to the t20 gravy train. I want players who want to play and will take it seriously when they do.
    NZ can't afford to give up on him. Someone needs to have a word with him.
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  2. #392
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hurricane View Post
    NZ can't afford to give up on him. Someone needs to have a word with him.
    In his current morph, we can. He would be a massive liability. When he grows up, he'll massively regret this and I hope it eats him alive. I say this as a staunch Wellngtonian and, up until the last few weeks, a massive Ryder fan.

  3. #393
    Cricketer Of The Year Cabinet96's Avatar
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    UK Sky will be showing the T20 warm ups. Good stuff.
    Quote Originally Posted by Flem274* View Post
    This English top three are cornflakes. They're not the most exciting thing out but they're pretty effective. Then the middle order are the sugar. Would be too much on their own but added to the cornflakes they add some much needed interest

    When KP returns he will be the banana..

  4. #394
    International Regular Kippax's Avatar
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    Oh no. Brumbeh's first second sighting of Nick Beard...

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  5. #395
    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kippax View Post
    Oh no. Brumbeh's first second sighting of Nick Beard...

    Nick Beard, HRV Cup Final - YouTube
    Good Lord. I don't have the words...
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  6. #396
    Request Your Custom Title Now! Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rvd619323 View Post
    Guptill
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athlai View Post
    Jeets doesn't really deserve to be bowling.
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    Well yeah Tendy is probably better than Bradman, but Bradman was 70 years ago, if he grew up in the modern era he'd still easily be the best. Though he wasn't, can understand the argument for Tendy even though I don't agree.
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  7. #397
    Cricketer Of The Year Bahnz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Young View Post
    In his current morph, we can. He would be a massive liability. When he grows up, he'll massively regret this and I hope it eats him alive. I say this as a staunch Wellngtonian and, up until the last few weeks, a massive Ryder fan.
    No we can't. Ryder is one of two genuinely top class batsmen in the country (not counting Kane yet as he's still at least a couple of years away). Those filling in for him have been found to be sub-standard. As for him being a liability, you could've said the same about Chris Cairns back in the mid-90's. Didn't mean that New Zealand Cricket could afford to give him the finger and give up on his considerable talents. It's awful to say, but the same rules don't apply to top talent, especially in a country like New Zealand.

    I'm not saying that I'm pleased that Jesse isn't coming back (though I do already have a couple of ideas for Howsie's avatar), but nor do I think that people should knee-jerk in this situation. Nothing's really changed. As much as we may not like it, Jesse isn't obligated to play for New Zealand. If he doesn't feel that he's ready, (and he's almost certainly right given how rubbish his batting has been in the Plunket Shield) then he shouldn't be playing. All we can do is hope that he changes his mind in time, and be ready to provide the best environment for his talents when he does.
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  8. #398
    Hall of Fame Member NZTailender's Avatar
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    Would be better if Ryder comes back in June for the long term rather than rushing him back now only to go down the same road and sit out another 12 months after playing for 6 months.
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  9. #399
    Cricket Web Staff Member / Global Moderator Neil Pickup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    Good Lord. I don't have the words...
    Do people just not care any more?
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  10. #400
    International Vice-Captain Mike5181's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnz View Post
    No we can't. Ryder is one of two genuinely top class batsmen in the country (not counting Kane yet as he's still at least a couple of years away). Those filling in for him have been found to be sub-standard. As for him being a liability, you could've said the same about Chris Cairns back in the mid-90's. Didn't mean that New Zealand Cricket could afford to give him the finger and give up on his considerable talents. It's awful to say, but the same rules don't apply to top talent, especially in a country like New Zealand.

    I'm not saying that I'm pleased that Jesse isn't coming back (though I do already have a couple of ideas for Howsie's avatar), but nor do I think that people should knee-jerk in this situation. Nothing's really changed. As much as we may not like it, Jesse isn't obligated to play for New Zealand. If he doesn't feel that he's ready, (and he's almost certainly right given how rubbish his batting has been in the Plunket Shield) then he shouldn't be playing. All we can do is hope that he changes his mind in time, and be ready to provide the best environment for his talents when he does.
    I wonder how much money has been spent along the way. All the thousands and thousands of dollars put behind him for coaching, fixing all those injuries etc. Does that all mean nothing? What about the name recognition he gained by playing for New Zealand? That enabled him to take lucrative T20 contracts. That's something he wouldn't have been able to do without NZC. The amount of chances he's had is ridiculous, and despite all that, he continues to play and act like a ****wit. If he was playing for Australia, this would no longer be an issue. He would be gone, simple as that. He doesn't deserve to play internationals, he's just incredibly lucky he's so talented, and New Zealand has an ordinary team. I'd much rather support hard-working guys like Williamson, Taylor, Guptill, Flynn etc.
    Last edited by Mike5181; 27-01-2013 at 06:41 PM.

  11. #401
    International Coach Zinzan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    Interesting article from Victor Marks in today's Observer ahead of the tour.

    Effectively says NZ used to maximise their talent to compete but are failing to do so now. Also makes the very reasonable point that teams don't necessarily have to love each other to pull in the same direction:
    Well, Vic was half-right re the Coney/Hadlee spat, but it was when the Windies toured NZ in 87' and not in the Caribbean. The reason for the spat was that Hadlee decided he should keep the car he won for being the B & H player of the season in Australia as opposed to selling it and sharing the profits with the team which had been standard protocol.

    The hilarious thing about this little spat is whilst they weren't talking the Windies batsmen repeatedly edged Hadlee to Coney at slip, which made it all the more awkward. Watch both players reactions here
    Last edited by Zinzan; 27-01-2013 at 06:48 PM.

  12. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zinzan View Post
    Well, Vic was half-right re the Coney/Hadlee spat, but it was when the Windies toured NZ in 87' and not in the Caribbean. The reason for the spat was that Hadlee decided he should keep the car he won for being the B & H player of the season in Australia as opposed to selling it and sharing the profits with the team which had been standard protocol.
    I think that was part of it, also Hadlee was critical of the teams professionalism in a newspaper column before, or maybe during, that Windies series. Coney & Turner weren't impressed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike5181
    he was playing for Australia, this would no longer be an issue. He would be gone, simple as that.
    There's a player in Australia called Luke Pomersbach who seems quite similar to Ryder in age, playing style, talent and off-field issues (tbf, Pomersbach's seem more serious).
    Last edited by jcas0167; 27-01-2013 at 07:48 PM.

  13. #403
    International Coach HeathDavisSpeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcas0167 View Post
    There's a player in Australia called Luke Pomersbach who seems quite similar to Ryder in age, playing style, talent and off-field issues (tbf, Pomersbach's seem more serious).
    Indeed. The issues seem much more serious in many ways. But I don't get the feeling that Australia have completely written him off playing for them - maybe some Aussies know better though? (seeing as my only reference is C9 commentary during the Big Bash)
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  14. #404
    Cricketer Of The Year Bahnz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike5181 View Post
    I wonder how much money has been spent along the way. All the thousands and thousands of dollars put behind him for coaching, fixing all those injuries etc. Does that all mean nothing? What about the name recognition he gained by playing for New Zealand? That enabled him to take lucrative T20 contracts. That's something he wouldn't have been able to do without NZC. The amount of chances he's had is ridiculous, and despite all that, he continues to play and act like a ****wit. If he was playing for Australia, this would no longer be an issue. He would be gone, simple as that. He doesn't deserve to play internationals, he's just incredibly lucky he's so talented, and New Zealand has an ordinary team. I'd much rather support hard-working guys like Williamson, Taylor, Guptill, Flynn etc.
    I think Ryder would've made a lot more money for the NZC, and raised a lot more interest in the game, than has been spent on him. He pretty much single-handedly generated signficant public interest in the HRV Cup this season and is probably close to being the most well known cricketer in the country.

    As for acting like a ****wit, I don't think you can seriously say he's done anything of the kind since he stood down from international cricket (unless you count that ridiculous sojourn in the boxing ring). As has been noted before, he's not the first international to take an indefinite timeout from the game, and he's not doing it just so that he can grab sum T20 cash (otherwise he would've ****ed off to the Big Bash this summer). He just doesn't believe he's ready for international cricket yet.

    It'd be great if Ryder had the dedication and ambition of Flynn or Guptill. He doesn't, and he's still better than those two will ever be. Life's unfair, deal with it. And while it's understandable that you're disappointed that he won't be playing against England, he's decided that it's ultimately what's best for his batting in the long run.

    In any case, I hope he returns to the New Zealand side later this year (the away series v Bangladesh now seems the soonest likely return).
    Last edited by Bahnz; 27-01-2013 at 09:11 PM.

  15. #405
    International Regular Kippax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnz View Post
    As for acting like a ****wit, I don't think you can seriously say he's done anything of the kind since he stood down from international cricket (unless you count that ridiculous sojourn in the boxing ring).
    Why is he batting the way he is in FC if not attitude though, is what Mike and Neil Young were maybe getting at. There was maybe a brief moment in that video where he tried to hold the pose, like a drunk in a 'yeah, I'm serious and solid' moment.

    Unfortunately you get the feeling the work required to wean himself out of the bad habits will never quite have a pressing enough catalyst to occur. McMillan making his last test ton at 29 also had more than a hint of that depressing, lower socio girl lost it quicker due to bad maintenance feel to it.



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