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Thread: South Africa ATG - Open Voting

  1. #106
    International 12th Man AndyZaltzHair's Avatar
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  2. #107
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Personall cannot rate Pollock ahead of (in order) Tendulkar, Headley, Lara, Chappell, Ponting or Hammond. Played on about four years in a strong team and managed to miss all of the great Aussie bowlers, didn't play againts the Indian Spinner or the Windies pacers at all. Also unlike Richards didn't get to perform in WSC and didn't perform that well for the Rest of the World Teams. Similar career in length and performance to Colin Croft (who doesn't get the credit he is due).

    Akram is just the most over rated player in cricket.

    Back on topic.

    Agree that Amla by the time he is done will take over one of these positions.
    So you don't rate Pollock so highly as he missed playing all the great bowlers, yet didn't Headley score a lot of his runs against weaker attacks than the one's that could've been fielded at the time?
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  3. #108
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Here are some interesting innings by Graeme Pollock....

    1. For about 27 years Pollock held the record for the most runs made during a one-day match (Border V Eastern Province, 1974) - 222.

    Scorecard: Untitled Document

    2. Pollock did in fact face Dennis Lillee at his fastest in a first class match. In 1974 he made 124 runs for the South African Invitation XI against the International Wanderers. We know that Lillee was not mucking about because he picked-up 7/27 in the second innings. The other bowlers were Walker, Gilmour, and Mallett;

    Scorecard: Untitled Document

    3. At age 40 he scored a century against Sylvester Clarke in a South Africa V West Indies 4-day match (1983);

    Scorecard: Untitled Document

    4. In 1969 he smashed a century off only 52 balls against Wes Hall while playing for the International Cavaliers against Barbados;

    Scorecard: Untitled Document

    In 1987 Pollock ended his career after scoring more runs (12,409) in the Currie Cup than any other batsman. In all, Pollock made 20,940 first class runs at 54.67 with 64 centuries. And to my knowledge this makes him the best run scorer to ever come out of South Africa.
    Last edited by watson; 13-12-2012 at 04:59 AM.
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  4. #109
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Didn't say he wasn't an ATG.

    With regard to Headley and Pollock, Pollock played Test cricket for approx 4 year, Headley up until the War, 10 years. Pollock was part of the best team in the world, Headley was the sole hope in a very vey team and especially the batting order. Compare Headley's pre war record againts England with that of Bradman's and they are not that far apart with the only bowler that Headley didn't face was Larwood and Larwood was only effective vs Australia in one series. Additionally the one series didn't send their full strength team the attack was still better than the South African and New Zealand attacks that Bradman plundered. In fact the two Lord Tennyson touring teams that Headley played againts were superior to the N.Z. and S.A squads. Headley played againts the only two strong teams of the era with Grimmett calling him the best onside played he had bowled to after struggling in that area to start the tour, unfortunately he never got the chance to play Australia again. In his last tour to England he was approaching Bradmans level and was totally dominat and really in his prime. He was the best player in the world and if not run out in his last innings he record may have been even better. Headley also has the third highest first class average in history mostly made vs almost test level touring teams and while touring England and Australia. Yes I rate Headley higher than Pollock, he was the the W.I team and scored 10 centuries in his first 19 tests out of a total of 22 for the team. He scored them againts Verity, Allen, Voce, Grimmett, Ironmonger, Rhodes ect. He was Atlas and the original and the greatest W.I. batsman
    Last edited by kyear2; 13-12-2012 at 07:16 AM.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3


  5. #110
    Cricketer Of The Year The Sean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Didn't say he wasn't an ATG.

    With regard to Headley and Pollock, Pollock played Test cricket for approx 4 year, Headley up until the War, 10 years. Pollock was part of the best team in the world, Headley was the sole hope in a very vey team and especially the batting order. Compare Headley's pre war record againts England with that of Bradman's and they are not that far apart with the only bowler that Headley didn't face was Larwood and Larwood was only effective vs Australia in one series. Additionally the one series didn't send their full strength team the attack was still better than the South African and New Zealand attacks that Bradman plundered. In fact the two Lord Tennyson touring teams that Headley played againts were superior to the N.Z. and S.A squads. Headley played againts the only two strong teams of the era with Grimmett calling him the best onside played he had bowled to after struggling in that area to start the tour, unfortunately he never got the chance to play Australia again. In his last tour to England he was approaching Bradmans level and was totally dominat and really in his prime. He was the best player in the world and if not run out in his last innings he record may have been even better. Headley also has the third highest first class average in history mostly made vs almost test level touring teams and while touring England and Australia. Yes I rate Headley higher than Pollock, he was the the W.I team and scoed 10 centuries in his first 19 tests iut of a total of 22 for the team. He sciredd them againts Verity, Allen, Grimmett, Ironmonger, Rhodes ect. He was Atlas and the original and the best W.I. batsman
    Headley's last tour of England was in 1939, and he averaged 60-odd in three Tests. That's not approaching Bradman's level, and as Bradman was still active Headley wasn't the best player in the world.

    Bradman never played New Zealand. God knows what he might have averaged if he had.

    And I do think it's a little disingenuous to just list the English bowlers each man faced and conclude that the English attacks Headley encountered were as strong - or nearly as strong - as the ones Bradman did, particularly at home. The teams England sent to Australia in those days were generally considerably stronger than the ones they sent to the Caribbean.

    I do agree, however, with the one-man army act Headley had to play for almost the entirety of his career, and placing Headley above Pollock in all-time batting rankings.
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  6. #111
    Cricketer Of The Year Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Jacques Kallis
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  7. #112
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Sean View Post
    Headley's last tour of England was in 1939, and he averaged 60-odd in three Tests. That's not approaching Bradman's level, and as Bradman was still active Headley wasn't the best player in the world.

    Bradman never played New Zealand. God knows what he might have averaged if he had.

    And I do think it's a little disingenuous to just list the English bowlers each man faced and conclude that the English attacks Headley encountered were as strong - or nearly as strong - as the ones Bradman did, particularly at home. The teams England sent to Australia in those days were generally considerably stronger than the ones they sent to the Caribbean.

    I do agree, however, with the one-man army act Headley had to play for almost the entirety of his career, and placing Headley above Pollock in all-time batting rankings.
    Sorry it was Sourh Africa and India where Bradman averaged 201 and , 178 respectively.

  8. #113
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Kallis: 22
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    Pollock: 20
    Taylor: 3
    Amla: 1

    Team so far

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    Next up Opening Bowlers

  9. #114
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Going quite smoothly

    Kindly choose any two of the following:

    Neil Adcock
    Peter Pollock
    Mike Procter
    Allan Donald
    Shaun Pollock
    Makahya Ntini
    Dale Steyn

  10. #115
    Cricketer Of The Year Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Allan Donald and Shaun Pollock

  11. #116
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  12. #117
    International Captain hendrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by centurymaker View Post
    allan donald

    dale steyn
    +1

  13. #118
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  14. #119
    International Coach morgieb's Avatar
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    Donald and Steyn.

    Harsh on Pollock and Proctor, they're in contention for 1st change IMO.
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  15. #120
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Donald & Adcock

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